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Thread: Routing help along MN River - MOA to Jordan

  1. #41
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    There is at least one;a brown flat plastic post with label exists but it's off the current path in the brush about 15 feet. I'll take a picture next time. It's the one I thought was a state park trail marker in one of my first post.

  2. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by seberly View Post
    I don't know if any of the signs are still there but an interested party could replace them.

    I've road that section a few times since '04 so I know what signs people are talking about. The last time was 3 years ago and I saw no signs so there is a good chance they're not even there anymore or else I must have missed them. Either way, I wouldn't worry about riding it. I never saw anyone around those parts.

  3. #39
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    More info - trail signed in 2006 - ride it if you can find it

    I checked my records and the trail (known as the MN Valley Trail - intended to go from Fort Snelling to LeSueur and beyond), was signed in 2006 by the always helpful Kent Karjala in conjunction with the US Fish & Wildlife Service and the City of Bloomington, attached is the map (.pdf) we used to locate the mile markers (we created GPS waypoints and gave them to the city of Bloomington). They in turn prepared this map (see link) which shows the trail in question as unimproved, dirt (i.e. natural surface), I don't know if any of the signs are still there but an interested party could replace them.

    I also attached an earlier map from 2006 which calls the section from 35W to the Cedar avenue bridge the "River Bottom Trail".

    http://www.ci.bloomington.mn.us/city...biking_map.pdf
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  4. #38
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    My mother had an old saying that she probably probably learned from her German mother: "Don't paint the devil on the wall". The devil, in this case, would be over-cautious concerns, based on incomplete and confusing information, that a long-standing legal riding route is no longer legal. I believe that if there indeed was a drastic change in policy regarding riding there, there would either be some definitive "no bicycles" signing, or contact with the MORC folks involved with the trail, that the policy has changed.

    Like the two previous posts suggested, just ride.
    Work is the curse of the riding class.

  5. #37
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    Lets just go for a ride down there! I looked at the gps thingy and have ridden all of it in the last few months. From the start of the route all the way to 41 in chaska is a breeze the real crap starts before you get to the Louisville swamp. Its all overgrown and washed out from the flooding this year. It might even be mowed now as the last stretch is a snowmobile trail

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snowboarder Guy View Post
    Actually, it's not on the map once you head west of 77. Have you looked at it? Here it is: http://www.fws.gov/midwest/Minnesota...ng_meadow.html ... Click on the map again to blow it up.

    The two track on the south side of Long Meadow Lake, north side of the Minnesota River, is what I'm talking about. It's on the map that you'll get to if you click on the link above. You can also get a map from the visitor's center. The land in question appears to be on USFWS land, so I'd expect that a USFWS map is the final word, unless it is overruled by signs on the ground. As I pointed out before (see photos in post #25), the signs on the ground say, in effect, keep out.
    As was stated before many people have been given permission, even money, to ride and improve this area. Feel free to not ride this area if you are not comfortable but many of us have been riding this area for years with no issues from the various land managers. You will be fine.

  7. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by seberly View Post
    I agree with Don, 5 or so years ago MORC signed that trail (Long Meadow Lake Trail) for the USFWS and the City of Bloomington - I got the permission myself and the City of Bloomington paid for the materials. The fact that it's on a map with a name is consistent with that. Yes there are a lot of old signs down there that should probably be removed.

    Ride away.
    Actually, it's not on the map once you head west of 77. Have you looked at it? Here it is: http://www.fws.gov/midwest/Minnesota...ng_meadow.html ... Click on the map again to blow it up.

    The two track on the south side of Long Meadow Lake, north side of the Minnesota River, is what I'm talking about. It's on the map that you'll get to if you click on the link above. You can also get a map from the visitor's center. The land in question appears to be on USFWS land, so I'd expect that a USFWS map is the final word, unless it is overruled by signs on the ground. As I pointed out before (see photos in post #25), the signs on the ground say, in effect, keep out.
    Last edited by Snowboarder Guy; 11-20-2011 at 12:07 PM. Reason: edited to fix URL

  8. #34
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    Trail is fine

    I agree with Don, 5 or so years ago MORC signed that trail (Long Meadow Lake Trail) for the USFWS and the City of Bloomington - I got the permission myself and the City of Bloomington paid for the materials. The fact that it's on a map with a name is consistent with that. Yes there are a lot of old signs down there that should probably be removed.

    Ride away.
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  9. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Don Youngdahl View Post
    As recently as 1 1/2 years ago, I had a conversation with U.S. F.&W. folks about the possibility of improvements to that trail. I'm sure they would have told me if the status had changed & it was now closed.
    Then someone ought to get USFW to change their maps to reflect this. Putting in some signage on the ground would be helpful, too. Making / announcing policy in a single conversation is not the way to go.

  10. #32
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    [QUOTE=Snowboarder Guy;438214]...................................Finally, I just got off the phone with someone at the wildlife refugee office. He told me that there is no public access on that two track road. It's for the electric company to access their towers and the rangers to get access to the refuge.

    .......................................QUOTE]

    Another example of a common communication problem - some folks don't really listen to a question posed to them. They just blurt out a stock answer that fits the majority of questions they receive on a topic. He gave the answer that applies if you were in your car or truck, not what applies for a bicycle or on foot.

    As recently as 1 1/2 years ago, I had a conversation with U.S. F.&W. folks about the possibility of improvements to that trail. I'm sure they would have told me if the status had changed & it was now closed.
    Last edited by Don Youngdahl; 11-19-2011 at 09:52 AM. Reason: clarification
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  11. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Snowboarder Guy View Post
    ...................................My conclusion (I'm not a lawyer, yada yada): if you want to keep a clean image for our sport, stay out of the area south of Long Meadow Lake and west of the 77 bridge.
    It appears to me that the information you got from U.S. Fish & Wildlife is a classic example of the old problem with government organizations: "The left hand doesn't know what the right hand is doing."

    A few years ago, MORC trail signs, authorized by the 3 land management entities with a stake in the area, City of Bloomington, Minnesota DNR, and U.S.F.&W, were installed by a MORC volunteer, from Bloomington Ferry Bridge to at least as far east as Hwy 77 south of Long Meadow Lake. This signage maybe went all the way east to the Refuge Interpretive Center, but my memory fails me on that.

    The MORC trail steward at the time was either Steve Eberly or Scott Thayer. Perhaps one of them can shed some light on the stuation.
    Work is the curse of the riding class.

  12. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by arcFlash View Post
    That's frustrating. The meadow trail goes to the power mast but the access does not. They should put a park sign at the end revoking permissions from the trail head. The signs in the pictures face the river but on the other side of the 'road' so a lay person would think the road is park trail (like the river) and the NWR starts on the other side of the sign. If you read the back of a yellow State Park sign, it says "Park Boundary". The gate faces into the woods as well so I cross in front of the gate, not though it or around it.

    Any chance the park people took the easy answer and said off limits because they didn't know and didn't want to do the investigation work themselves?
    As it is, the official / legal trail ends at the bridge, though you can take the ped bridge across the river and then head to the northeast, on the south side of the river, through Fort Snelling State Park. (Unfortunately, it's very sandy.)

    The sign that reads "no unauthorized vehicles" is at the start of the double track.

    The sign that reads "National Wildlife Refuse / Unauthorized Entry Prohibited" is about 30 yards past that. There's another sign, facing the river near the start of the double track, that says the same thing.

    So, if you're riding south of Long Meadow Lake / on the north bank of the river, on the doubletrack, there ARE signs that say, in effect, keep out. Note that this is all on the opposite side of the lake from the trail that starts at the Lyndale lot and continues to the spur for the Indian Mounts school.

  13. #29
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    I just finished a ride through here this morning and there is a useable trail through here. I don't remember seeing any signs since the last floods but two years ago there were MORC mileage signs on the trail from 77 to the boat launch. When you come off the ped bridge and travel west along the riverbank the service road tapers to doubletrack until the power lines. At this point you stay left and you will find the singletrack. It's a little undefined at points due to the sand and leaves but with a little extra push you should be able to get through. A fat bike floats right through. This will take you to the singletrack leading to the boat launch.

    I ride from Mendota to Lyndale or 169 most Fridays or Saturdays and wouldn't mind showing you the routes.

    Sent from my Droid using Tapatalk

  14. #28
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    That's frustrating. The meadow trail goes to the power mast but the access does not. They should put a park sign at the end revoking permissions from the trail head. The signs in the pictures face the river but on the other side of the 'road' so a lay person would think the road is park trail (like the river) and the NWR starts on the other side of the sign. If you read the back of a yellow State Park sign, it says "Park Boundary". The gate faces into the woods as well so I cross in front of the gate, not though it or around it.

    Any chance the park people took the easy answer and said off limits because they didn't know and didn't want to do the investigation work themselves?

  15. #27
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    Here's a map. The Long Lake Meadow Trail is in yellow



    Here's a link to the map of the Long Meadow Lake Unit, large:

    http://www.fws.gov/midwest/Minnesota...w_lake-new.pdf

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