Big Wallet, No balls

[ice ice baby]

This pisses me off, yet it's funny. I'm sick and tired of seeing guys with nice, nice bikes(Specialized Epic, Trek Fuel 90,100, Santa Cruz Blur) not doing jack while riding. I'm riding behind three guys with hotshot bikes who can't do any of the rock gardens at Lebanon or won't do the log drop. What's the matter, are they afraid they're going to chip some paint on their $3000 bikes. Gimme a break. Most of the guys I've seen wont even go down Jan's rock. Please, isn't that why you the Marzocchi Marathon with 105 MM travel! It's impossible to fall down that. 80% of the guys at lebanon roll, yes roll over the tabletop. Why don't you all get Huffy's and just ride in the street if you're not going to do anything!:mad:

[Rockhoppa]

I see that at lebanon alot also, that is what those bikes are made for and yet they don't do anything!!!! Some people try everything and have good bikes but you see more people not trying things with great bikes!!!:banana:

[grizzly adam]

When you go into a shop and drop 3k on a bike that you think is totally cool, you don't get the skills to go with it. duh

Why does it bother you - do you feel bad cuz you don't have their bike? They'll get better I'm sure.

Did you bother to talk to these people or did you just scoff at them and tell your friends? Ask 'em how they like the bike, how long have they been riding, where do they ride. Maybe they're just riding for the first year and they wanted to get the coolest ride in town so they saved their monies for two years.

Am I a bad person if I own a BMW M3 and don't drive cloverleafs at 60mph all the time or if I don't constantly burn out to show everyone that my car has 300+ hp? I don't think so.

[ice ice baby]

Good point Adam :banana: Actually I do talk to these people and ask what kind of riding they do and where there got there bikes......etc. I just think it's funny that when they say it handles the rocks really well and they are WALKING through the rock gardens. There are plenty of great riders out there with nice bikes but I personally wouldn't spend 3K to walk a bike through easy sections. There's hiking trails for that!:banana: :banana: Two bananas for bikes under $1000.

[Krejci]

Am I a bad person if I own a BMW M3 and don't drive cloverleafs at 60mph all the time or if I don't constantly burn out to show everyone that my car has 300+ hp? I don't think so.

No not a bad person but a pu$$y cat at driving:banana: :banana: I mean if you fo not plan on doing that then why get the 40,000 dollar BMW, if you plan on doing driving that a 11,000 Ford Taurus can do. I think its all about show. Yeah they could be beginners but if they are then y the advanced bike when the huffy will do?!?!!!

[gopherhockey]

We kinda discussed this in another thread a while ago. I guess I don't really care what a person rides and how much they spend as long as they are having a good time. If riding a $4k bike makes them feel better, then more power to em' I guess.

I ride my Blur and ride it hard. Gave up on keeping it looking nice after the first 10 miles... but, I do try clean it up from time to time - once in a while you will see it all nice and shiny. I'm not ashamed of that - cuz I'm probably passing most people on my nice shiny expensive bike.

I sometimes ride very hard, but when I get to mile 15+ I sometimes start to roll most the obstacles. I get tired of doing the same things so I treat it more like a bump in the trail rather than something I need to show great form on. Sometimes I drop the double log drop, sometimes I just ride around the "easy" way. Sometimes I clear the tabletop, sometimes I just roll it. I even bypass the bridges from time to time just because it mixes things up. Either way I'm getting a good workout and having fun.

Perhaps these people are on their 17th mile and already rode hard. Or, maybe they will pick up their skills as they go along. I know owning a Blur can be expensive, but it sure doesn't hurt even if one is a beginner. The new technologies like VPP and brain shocks are fun for anyone of all levels. Frankly all FS riders could do without the BOB - doesn't take an expert to take advantage of these new designs.

Having said all that, yea.. if a guy thinks he is showing off or something thats a whole other story. Just blast past him on your [insert bike here] and leave him in the dust... maybe another year he'll be able to do the same. ;)

[SPR]

I'm with John and Adam on this one. I don't care what bike people ride or how they ride it. If they are having fun or trying to increase their skills and happen to be walking a technical section more power to them. We shouldn't criticize how others ride based on what they're riding. We all started out on some kind of bike, some of which were cheap and others which were expensive.

[Krejci]

Yeah Roger i agree with you but i mean i just think it looks pretty funny, i mean yeah its a darn good bike and all but what is the use if they are so afraid to do everything. They will never get over it, until they actually try it! Maybe they will one day but it just looks funny to see such a good bike get treated like a toddler!

[grizzly adam]

Originally posted by Krejci
[B]No not a bad person but a pu$$y cat at driving:banana: :banana: I mean if you fo not plan on doing that then why get the 40,000 dollar BMW, if you plan on doing driving that a 11,000 Ford Taurus can do. I think its all about show.

Or better yet, spend less than $20 and do that in a MINI!

[/QUOTE][B]Yeah they could be beginners but if they are then y the advanced bike when the huffy will do?!?!!! [/QUOTE]

If a rigid fork will do, why a suspension? If canti brakes will do, why V-brakes? Because they're better and make the ride more fun. If someone has the money to drop on a top-of-line ride before their skills have matured, let 'em. At least they're out supporting what we love to do - ride. I'd rather see them on an expensive ride than drop parts from the Huffy that I might run over!

[sidxc]

Who cares what some one rides? At least they are riding. Maybe some one makes a 100k a year, so why would they buy a Geo when they can go Caddie? I think hot head attitudes take the fun out of riding for people that are just getting into it. When you are new at something, seeing ppl that are better then u can some times feel intimidating. People have passed me on crappy bikes, and I've passed ppl on the pimp rides. I'm just happy to say Hi and see some one else enjoying there ride. Any ways I just think that any bike is better then the Boob Tube.:)

[jkalla]

I bought my bike 7 years ago and at the time it was a prety nice bike - it still is. I have ridden with a lot of people that have less expensive bikes that have trouble with either the technical sections or climbing or whatever. I was told many times that if they had a bike like mine then they would be a much better rider. As we all know - the majority of it is the rider - not the bike. I have given many people this advice for free. Some people spend $3000 to figure it out.

[EmL34]

Best bet is to live and let live. Nobody has the right to decide how others should ride their bikes, how much they should spend, etc.

[ice ice baby]

Gimme a break fellas, ya have to consider I'm thinking like a sixteen year old with a weekly income of about 5 bucks. I guess if a I was a computer freak and made 100g's a year I might go buy some high-end bikes too. Relax, I was just trying to spark a little controversy like any kid would do.:crazy2:

[gopherhockey]

Originally posted by ice ice baby
Gimme a break fellas, ya have to consider I'm thinking like a sixteen year old with a weekly income of about 5 bucks. I guess if a I was a computer freak and made 100g's a year I might go buy some high-end bikes too. Relax, I was just trying to spark a little controversy like any kid would do.:crazy2:

No, not at all - it was a good post. Any post that brings up good comments and discussion is well worth it.

I know I have learned a lot and see many things from many different viewpoints after spending the last many months on just this board alone. Keep it up Ice - keep your comments flowing... there is never anything wrong in expressing your opinion.

[SPR]

Originally posted by gopherhockey
No, not at all - it was a good post. Any post that brings up good comments and discussion is well worth it.

I know I have learned a lot and see many things from many different viewpoints after spending the last many months on just this board alone. Keep it up Ice - keep your comments flowing... there is never anything wrong in expressing your opinion.

My feelings exactly.

[Dr. Guitar]

I'm not a fan of those who spend big on their bikes either, but the point was made else where... if it wasn't for these guys out spending their skills, the bike companies probably wouldn't do the same amount of advancement on the less expencive bikes.

What I really don't like is seeing tons of ppl standing anywhere on a trail. LH is the worst for this. The parking lot is filled with people loitering. Ride your bike all ready! As far as passing some one who is "overbiked" on a rockgarden... I like doing that. You get to pass someone who looks like they are absolutluy misserable, walking their bike, and I dance by on my old bike with all it's creeking, groaning, and swiss cheese paint job from crashes.

[soupboy]

Yep, I spend ungodly amounts on my bikes. I don't even want to contemplate adding it all up. Parts, tools, frames, tires, etc. etc. etc. Heck, if my wife prohibits me from getting a motorcycle I'm going to make up for it somehow. It gets me out into nature and gets my big butt some exercise.

You can call someone a poser or a wimp - but why? Let your riding speak for itself. I never fail to be impressed when a young kid on ANY TYPE of bike just hammers and rips. That's awesome - hopefully another lifelong rider in the making. Personally, the only obstacle I've refused to ride so far is the log ride after the table top - the risk return profile isn't there for me. I envision a nasty 50/50 wipeout where I pile drive myself off the log. I digress.

Some day, when younger riders have a real job (whatever that means) they can make the call on what they want to spend on bikes. Personally, I love nice things. I love to take them apart, see how they work and put them back together. I do all my own maintenance - forks, hydro brakes, complete builds. I enjoy it. I love seeing the craftsmanship of boutique bikes. It is something I appreciate. Clever design, thoughtful cable routing, beautiful welds - they are all "art" to me. If the only bikes consumers bought were big name, big box brands, hundreds of America's best craftsman and progressive riders would be out of a paycheck - the same class of rider a few here on this thread purport themselves to be. Heck, if it weren't for those folks we'd still have Biopace chainrings and u-brakes behind the BB (sorry, dating myself here, some of you were probably still breast feeding then).

Spending a ton will NOT make you a better rider. Spending a little more for parts/bikes that fit your style and skill WILL help you progress. For example, if you ride really hard but roll on a lower-end fork or wheelset - you are compromising both performance and your safety. Get something beefier that will match your hard driving style and it will help you progress.

Just enjoy the ride and don't angrily covet thy neighbors chi-chi steed - he/she might just let you take it for a spin. Just ask "...Hey, nice day, how was your ride?..." Heck, they might even be a nice person.

Sean

PS - I love to loiter in the lot with friends and brews post ride. If you are anti-social, that's cool too. But you might just be missing out on a tasty beverage or an interesting conversation.:etard:

[Krejci]

Best bet is to live and let live. Nobody has the right to decide how others should ride their bikes, how much they should spend, etc.

WOAH WOAH easy fella~ all we were doing was talkin about how funny it was to see people drop 3 g's on a bike and not use the full petentional of the bike, we were NEVER DECIDING on how they should ride and we sure as heck NEVER said that beginnes can only spend X amount of dollars on a bike. I mean everybody has thier right to voice thier oppinion, hence "freedom of speech" but If you quote was directed at us, i would re-consider what you said b\c that is just BS :mad:

[ice ice baby]

Originally posted by soupboy187

Spending a ton will NOT make you a better rider. [/B] Yes, finally the truth comes out to all of the big spenders out there! I ride in the parking lot for a while after a ride to cool down and simply relax and talk to other guys. If you don't like that I relax and talk to friends you - 1. Have major issues 2. Should get the hell out of the parking lot. banana: :banana: Two bananas for chilling with friends after a ride!

[gopherhockey]

Originally posted by Krejci
WOAH WOAH easy fella~ all we were doing was talkin about how funny it was to see people drop 3 g's on a bike and not use the full petentional of the bike,

I loved reading this while seeing your avatar of Chris Farley... hehe...

One thing I want to point out to everyone (once again..) how do people really know if these individuals on expensive bikes are using their full potential or not? What I mean to say is... did you see them from start to finish of their ride? The very same guy that some may thing has put 3k+ into a bike and isn't using it could very well be the same guy who is on his 3rd hour on the trail, or who did a ton of riding all week and is just out takin' it easy. Or maybe even this person got hurt earlier and is just doing their best to get back to the lot... We have to watch what we say sometimes I think... it is too easy to judge on the trail. Even I find myself getting passed toward the end of my ride (and I HATE being passed! I think its a guy thing..) - I always wonder if someone thinks I am that slow, or if they might actually realize I may have already done 12 more miles than they will probably do all day ;)

The very same rider we all "drop" at certain points in the trail may actually be a stronger rider than we are... yes its fun to ride past guys - and maybe more fun if you notice they have a more expensive bike... but that really doesn't mean much without the full story.

As for visiting in the lot after a ride.. yea, thats cool. I have no problem with it - its all a part of being a mountain biker. I do wish there were more spots in the lot though. I also think the guy with the portable shower hanging off his truck might be a bit too much (especially when he strips in front of everyone to use it) - but hey, maybe he has a long ride home. ;) (I usually try get out of the lot quicker if it is during a busy time though.. especially when you see people hunting for spaces)

Its too bad we don't have a much larger lot and more room to mingle at Leb. Rumor is the lot may move out into the open field just south of the current lot someday... at that point I'd think the lot will be able to hold more and maybe be less of a temptation for kids out playing sports in the field to the north of the current lot.

[Dr. Guitar]

Not the point of my parking lot comment at all.

It seems like lately I have been having to park next to the tailgaters. The guys who keep all their doors open, while Madona or something else, turns the lot into a block party.

Side note, this happens less at LH then other places.

I'm not anti-social, it's just that if I am going to put up with rush hour to get to the trail, get out of my way, It's time to ride! If you need a tube, go ahead and ask. If you want to know about my bike or anything else go ahead and ask.

[Krejci]

One thing I want to point out to everyone (once again..) how do people really know if these individuals on expensive bikes are using their full potential or not? What I mean to say is... did you see them from start to finish of their ride?

Well the few times that i see them yes i see them at an entrence to a trail and lts like Ok he just went around Jans Rock, and yup there he is walkin in the garden, i mean i have no problem with it what so ever, i know that i am guilty of doing all of those things, but i just think its kinda funny. Question, you see a guy in a 1967 ferrair GT California, and you see him get a ticket for going too slow, would you say oh well he must be tired, so he is going slow, or would you think its hillarious b\c he has a very fast very EXPENSIVE car and he got a ticket for going slow. I dont know, but to me i think that that is funny, i mean just look at my avartar :laugh: :laugh:

[sidxc]

i mean just look at my avartar
I miss Farley, :( was one of the greatest at makeing me laugh

[zerpy]

I know this has basically been re-hashed to death in other discussions, but it just goes to show that the best hardware in the world won't make you a better rider.

So I would be one of the riders that everyone on here is bitching about, walking through/over things, stopping on the trail because I left my lungs a quarter mile back, etc... Now, I don' t have a Blur or an epic, etc... (wish I did though, but I think that is more of a fact that if I could spend that kind of $$ on a bike then I would be a hell of a lot more comfortable in other areas of my life! - financially that is) but, I've got about 600 bucks into my ride. Bought a hardrock because it is about the strongest frame out there (except for maybe your P2, Shad) and I've upgraded a couple of things. But I didn't start doing any killer moves off log crossings because I got a set of Z-pedals. I still have to walk my bike over the big log crossing on the intermediate loop. For urban situations, I don't do stairs very well and ususally will walk the bike down them. Been able to handle them a couple of times, but not much. I've got a front suspension, though so why don't I just go down them? Maybe I should get a bike with a rigid fork if I'm not going to do stairs?

My point is, even with my 600 bucks that I've got into my "middle of the road" bike, I still don't even remotely ride it to it's potential. Everytime I go out I'm getting a bit better. Actaully, I stop more often on the trail now than I used to so that I can ride more aggressively. Otherwise, half way through (and I don't ride the X or XX loops yet) I have not strength left to do a damn thing.

If I had $4000 bucks to spend I would have bought an epic right out of the shoot (we can argue whether that would be a waste of money or not in a different forum). I still would be walking it over the big log crossing and would still be terrified of stairs. I wouldn't be a poser though because I would still be trying to learn and do more as I felt comfortable.

Although, I might not be riding much more if I was ridiculed on the trail. Then I guess I would be a poser by definition because I'd have this really nice bike but would be afraid to ride it because of the **** I got on the trail when I had to walk it.

[Torpedo]

I love reading these threads...not that we shouldnt all just play nice and leave each to his own, but I also am guilty of checking out the expensive bike and looking for a poser. If you cant have a cooler ride then you want to crush them on the trail. Anyway, who cares, I have really never found one. You just have to talk to people to find out the deal.

I pass a guy the other day at Leb and he had a sweet full supension single speed, and was riding with full knee pads and shin guards. I though he was just going to pound the trail. I pass him on the second loop and said hi and asked about the gear, which he replied "... they were the same price as a co-pay". (actually, a very valid point). I meet up with him again in the parking lot and start talking about the bike, (which I thought he wasnt getting the full potential out of). Turns out hes 45 , just started last year and ride about 3 time a month. He happens to have that kind of cash to buy the good stuff and is just really learning. Neat guy, cool bike.. funny how opinions change after talking to people.

... but i'm really missing out on offer for brews after a ride... must be hanging out in the wrong lot.

[martini]

Hey "S", err torpedo, I think I know who you're talking about. Did he have a bell(like a cowbell, or other obnoxious thing) on his bike? Was he all decked out in black? Full face helmet? If so, he was pullin' your leg. He's been riding for a few years now. Lives near StPaul or somthing. I could go into more, but it's close to slander, so I'll stop.

[Torpedo]

No, no face guard, no bell. The shin guard and elbow pad were brand new out of the package. The bike was also brand new, it was the first or second ride on it, mint.

He talked like a newbee, even concerned about the blood running down my elbow. I fell on the rocks where he probably walked. I was hurt, he wasn't...hmm, maybe these guys my have it right.


( i still think chicks dig scars )

[cheese4brains]

en·vy
1 : painful or resentful awareness of an advantage enjoyed by another joined with a desire to possess the same advantage

If I had run across a thread like this before I joined MORC last month, I may not have joined. This topic makes newcomers such as myself feel unworthy to ride anything but my toddler's trike. I believe in free speech, but I also understand that what I type here will be judged by many to be what MORC and its members stand for. :(

If you see me next riding a Huffy Trike "single-speed" with bar-ends turned up around the XX log piles, mock me if you must. At least I'll be out riding and I'll have a huge smile on my face ...


:cheesy:

[martini]

keep in mind that the original post was made by teenagers...not that there's anything wrong with that...they just haven't lived on thier own yet and don't know the 'joy' of paying unending bills while also attempting to save cash for a new ride. We'd all love to have those mega buck rigs, but for some, as much as we want, $3k is just too rich. Hell, $1k is stretching it! I'm just happy to see people out riding, no matter if they're HS newbies on low end Trek's, or an IT manager on a $3k+ Blurr. As long as you're haveing a good time, its fine by me!

[gopherhockey]

Originally posted by cheese4brains


If I had run across a thread like this before I joined MORC last month, I may not have joined.


Why? This is a message forum that has lots of varied opinions... not all are MORCs. MORC advocates gaining and maintaining new trails, as well as all other aspects of our great sport. As an organization we would never disrespect or say anything bad about anyone based on their bike or their riding style. We're all about education and furthering the cause...

Please - this goes for everyone - don't let the fact that this is a morc message forum cause you to take all opinions expressed here as ours. Many online are morc members, but many are not. Many morc members or board members even may have individual opinions that also don't happen to coincide with the theme of MORC as a whole.

Threads like these are interesting... many opinions expressed in these types of threads will generally tick some people off... but that comes with the territory. What I take out of them is some amount of education on how others feel, and perhaps try to express my own opinion... for whatever it is worth... and hope others might learn from me. Taken as a whole, the thread itself is generally very positive - even the original comment itself has merit as long as the individual is open to thinking about various responses posted.

It is exactly people like yourself that make MORC stronger and grow. Not just in numbers but in opinions. We value all our members no matter what crazy ideas they might have hehe :p

How's that for a disclaimer ;)

[denis-on-enduro]

YOu make a very good point there ice.

But why buy a ****ty bike when your doing somewhat hard riding at lebanon or the farm.

People who think they bought a nice bike from rei or some other store are stupid and just like to save when there spending to much than when they sholdn't.

Like your manitou axels suck. Those shocks bottom out when you rid on curbs if you havent noticed. They were at least 100 bucks of your bike and now your getting new ones.
\
and your frame what is wrong with that thing.

Nice point though about people spending too much.

[Dr. Guitar]

First of all, to Zerpy. I think you are doing it the right way. Keep at it. If I could afford a bike with full XTR, I would probably downgrade most of it, to get stronger, less race like stuff. Such as you needing something strong.

Take this into consideration everyone else. Let's say you go out and get yourself the best pair of Air Jordans. Then you go out to my old neighborhood to shoot some hoops. If you are even average, you are going to be made fun of. Everyone will be gunning for you. That's what is going on here. It's not that anyone should feel unwelcome, there is just some teasing that happens. I'm not jealous that anyone has a bike better than mine. After all, I have test ridden many recently, and wouldn't want most of them. I used to get teased so much becuse of the color of my bike, but it doesn't bother me.

[gopherhockey]

I get teased when I show up to the trail with a clean bike.. whatz up with dat? ;)

Seriously though I have been known to snicker at people for one reason or another.. but it would take quite a bit for me to feel the need to laugh at someone because of their choice in bikes or equipment.... as long as they are out there trying, thats what matters.

More power to anyone who sets a tire down on the trails... regardless of age, sex, equipment, skill level etc.

Even more power to those that encourage them to keep on riding....