Trail Conditions in Detail - Lebanon Hills

[ryno lite]

There is something wrong with you John!!:D
I'd give up one day like yesterday for a half day of summer riding!!:crazy2: C'mon summer where are you!!

I'm with Greg here! Can't wait for April. The radio said 1-2 inches tonight so hopefully we can get that for Lebanon so that you guys have good riding conditions.

[dave t]

I don't think I would trade either for the other but I really like snow biking. It really hones your skills to ride a trail where if you stray from a 8 inch wide line, you get pulled into the shrubbery and have to fight to stay up.

Anyone who complains in the summer that the trails are built too wide should really get out now when the trail is only a couple pugsley treads in places.

[DanB]

I don't think I would trade either for the other but I really like snow biking. It really hones your skills to ride a trail where if you stray from a 8 inch wide line, you get pulled into the shrubbery and have to fight to stay up.

Anyone who complains in the summer that the trails are built too wide should really get out now when the trail is only a couple pugsley treads in places.

I agree with Dave. Snow riding makes for strong handling skills come springtime. So bring on the white stuff I say!!! Well at least for a little while longer and then it can all go away. :D

[dave t]

If you have hated the snow because it was loose and you couldn't get through it without pushing, give it another try. The trail has packed in now to ideal winter condition. No sinking and no studs required.

[gopherhockey]

I agree with Dave. Snow riding makes for strong handling skills come springtime. So bring on the white stuff I say!!! Well at least for a little while longer and then it can all go away. :D

I really enjoy the way winter riding teaches me better balance. Areas like Tedman's curve are totally fun in the snow - typically you are going slower so you fight to stay upright AND get over the obstacles. In some ways its easier, in some ways its harder.... maybe the best thing is that its just different.

Even though I LOVE snow riding, I'm with you here as well. Lets have snow and cold during winter, then it can turn nice for the rest of the year. The longer we can keep the snow around the further into March we can ride... then lets hope for 2-3 weeks of quick drying and then we're back out again!

Come April 15 or later the warm weather lovers will get their chance to see all the new stud scrapes the rocks are getting. :p

[timmy]

Just got back from riding Leb. Trail is in great shape!!

[tedsti]

The sun is getting high and strong. The bare spots are starting to get muddy out there with an air temp of around 21F. If you plan on riding this weekend, try to finish your ride before noon.

[gopherhockey]

The sun is getting high and strong. The bare spots are starting to get muddy out there with an air temp of around 21F. If you plan on riding this weekend, try to finish your ride before noon.

Yup, even with the cold the sun is gaining strength. Get out and do some winter/snow riding before the trail closes up. Next week looks to be warming up - if those spots get much worse we will be closing down the trail until we either get more snow/cold or we open up in late April.

Get your ride in now while you can!

[gopherhockey]

I was hoping not to have to post this for another 3 weeks or so... but Lebanon Hills is now closed.

The first part of the trail is fine, but the last part is a muddy mess, and we're in for even more warm temps this week.

Orange fences are up... I hope not until April when we normally open up for spring, but we'll see.

PLEASE stay off. Its up to Dakota County and us to determine closings like this, its NOT up to the individual. Closed means closed, orange fence over the trail and a TRAIL CLOSED sign also means closed. (I know that can be confusing for some) :p

[Pandl]

Unfortunately, the confused people probably don't read these posts.

[gopherhockey]

Unfortunately, the confused people probably don't read these posts.

Yea... I'm preaching to the choir I'm sure. ;) Maybe if we all pass the word along we'll catch some of the clueless before they head out there. I think the temptation is too great when they are sitting there in the lot surprised by the orange fence.

We might not be done quite yet tho:

The 5 News Outlook
We have the makings of what could be the biggest snowstorm of the season shaping up for the coming weekend. At this point it's nothing more than a figment of the computers imagination. If it does come true, snow should begin on Friday and could last until Monday of next week! If that happens we're looking at enough snow to snarl traffic for a long time around Minnesota, Wisconsin, parts of Iowa, and the eastern Dakotas. Stay tuned because the forecast will be changing as we head through the week!

[ryno lite]

We might not be done quite yet tho:

Plus, the 10 day forcast calls for highs in the mid to upper twenties by the weekend and in to next week. With new snow and colder weather, hopefully it can open again for another 2-3 weeks before the inevitable thaw. Personally, I can't wait for Spring! Nothing like a 4 month break from biking to get excited again for biking. I like the break, but I am ready to ride again!

[gopherhockey]

Just verified this morning that Dakota County has notified Parks Patrol (Sheriff's Dept) that the trail is closed until further notice.

[mtnbykr]

....Dakota County has notified Parks Patrol (Sheriff's Dept) that the trail is closed until further notice.

does any of this info ever make it to the local tv/radio stations or fishwraps??

[gopherhockey]

does any of this info ever make it to the local tv/radio stations or fishwraps??

That would assume that more than a few dozen people even care... ;)

It would be nice if we had some way of getting the word out more that trails are closed etc. Especially when all the trails are closed for the typical spring thaw period.

[gopherhockey]

Winter storm warning:

STORM TOTAL ACCUMULATIONS SHOULD RANGE FROM 9 TO 12 INCHES IN MOST LOCATIONS... WITH AS MUCH AS 15 TO 18 INCHES POSSIBLE ALONG THE INTERSTATE 35 CORRIDOR AND THE SAINT CROIX RIVER VALLEY.


Perhaps we'll be re-opening the trail after this weekend... we may need snowshoe help if this actually happens as predicted.

[krazykatie]

Winter storm warning:



Perhaps we'll be re-opening the trail after this weekend... we may need snowshoe help if this actually happens as predicted.


I could make it out sunday for some packin.:)

[syntaxjunkie]

this may just be the opportunity i've been waiting for: a chance to see if these snowshoes that have been sitting in my basement for the past five years actually work...

[bigwheel]

After change of plans, I'm in town this weekend. So, I'm also for a Sunday Snowshoe Stomp at Leb. Somebody post up a group stomp.

[tedsti]

Snowshoes?!?!!??, what the heck did I build a pug for? You can take your snowshoes and......... :D

[timmy]

I might be able to help out if my brothers girlfriend will let me borrow her snowshoes.:D

[krazykatie]

I might be able to help out if my brothers girlfriend will let me borrow her snowshoes.:D


Bla bla bla...call her up and tell her your coming to get them!:p I have an extra pair for someone small to use also. The earlier the better Sunday; I plan on boarding by early afternoon.

[DanB]

Bla bla bla...call her up and tell her your coming to get them!:p I have an extra pair for someone small to use also. The earlier the better Sunday; I plan on boarding by early afternoon.

It would be a good day to hit the slopes on Sunday wouldn't it. Too much work and my mind is mush. :embarass:

[crux]

Time to dust off the snowshoes. Would not mind helping to stomp down the trail.

[ryno lite]

I might be up for this as well.

[[defective]]

Nothing like an afternoon on snowshoes, followed by an evening in with a steamy mug of sinus infection.

[Nickel]

Katie I will call dibs on your extra pair of snowshoes but if someone else knows for sure they will make it, they can take them.

[Ish]

Is anyone riding Saturday afternoon before the snow hits? Is it back open or is it still closed?

[gopherhockey]

Is anyone riding Saturday afternoon before the snow hits? Is it back open or is it still closed?

Closed. We need significant snow to re-open.

Had last nights rain actually been snow we would be riding right now. Nice of the forecasters to get us all in a tizzy over nothing.

Maybe things will change today.

[Ish]

Thanks for the update John.

[gopherhockey]

They keep lowering the snow forecast every time I check. At this rate I doubt it will be worth re-opening Leb only to close it again when it gets into the 30s next week. Thanks goes out to Wisconsin for giving us all the dry air and runing our chance for snow.

I'm beginning to think that people like hearing about the big bad scary storms headed our way and the meteorologists love to fuel that fire rather than being accurate. I seriously don't remember the last time a big rain or snow was predicted in which we came anywhere near their forecast.

Good for those who are ready to be done with winter... bad for those of us who want to ride still...

We'll be bringing additional fences out to Leb soon to close off more access points in order to make poaching not worth the effort.

[Pandl]

On Thursday one of the news channel was calling this weekends storm the Storm ofthe Century. At least it is finally snowing.

[gopherhockey]

Ok, we've had enough snow now to open Leb up for a while... hopefully the temps won't climb up quickly and make us close it down right away.

I won't be able to get to the trail to open up the orange fence until early afternoon, however.

Snowshoers should consider the trail open season - we'd be happy to have you out there packing the bike trails down!

[bigwheel]

2/25 9:30am -- TRAIL IS OPEN :banana:

The snow fences are now removed and the trail is still untouched by humans since last night's snowfall.

Go out and have fun while you can. As soon as it warms up, it's going to have to be closed again.

BTW, The parking lot is not yet plowed, and it is tough getting in. If you don't have 4wd, you might want to give them a few hours to clear the lot. You can probably also park somewhere off of Covington Lane (north of the lot) and trek across the soccer field.

[dave t]

Open but tough going. I tried to ride the snow shoed intermediate section out of the lot and couldn't get anywhere. I had a bit of success in the untracked part of the beginner loop but there was way too much pushing.

[bigwheel]

Open but tough going. I tried to ride the snow shoed intermediate section out of the lot and couldn't get anywhere. I had a bit of success in the untracked part of the beginner loop but there was way too much pushing.

The freezing rain on Saturday left an icy base. Then another 8 inches of snow on top of that, and it became unrideable. You can see from the tracks that even the pugsleys didn't make it very far, and we pushed our bikes for all but about 10 feet.

Right now, the trail needs a good stomp (tuesday night). Of course, if/when the weather warms up, the trail willl turn into a mud fest and have to be closed down.

[JDEcho]

Any updates on the trail conditions? Just wondering if Leb will still be open on wednesday night? I've got my fingers crossed. Thanks, Joe

[bigwheel]

Any updates on the trail conditions? Just wondering if Leb will still be open on wednesday night? I've got my fingers crossed. Thanks, Joe

I think it will be open, but it will be questionable if it will be very rideable. We tried on Sunday and even the Pugsleys couldn't ride the deep snow on top of ice condition.

Tonight, there is a snowshoe stomp in place of the ride. If we can make it all the way around, that should help.

Post up after you give it a try.

[JDEcho]

I think it will be open, but it will be questionable if it will be very rideable. We tried on Sunday and even the Pugsleys couldn't ride the deep snow on top of ice condition.

Tonight, there is a snowshoe stomp in place of the ride. If we can make it all the way around, that should help.

Post up after you give it a try.
Thanks, I will post my report if it's open wednesday. Joe

[gopherhockey]

A dozen or so of us did a snowshoe stomp last night at Leb. We were able to pack down the outside (intermediate) loop but did not enter the X or XX. I think the outside loop should be ok, but the X/XX will need stomping before anyone will likely be able to ride there.

Thanks to everyone who came out last night! 2.5 hours of shoeing - what a great workout.

Looks like we're going to get another wave of snow starting tonight... looks like we have more snowshoeing ahead.

[JDEcho]

Three of us hit Leb wednesday night. Although the trail was obviously packed by snow shoes it still wasn't rideable. We were told by someone on snow shoes that once you got out of the pines the trail was better. So we basically walked most of the way out of the pines to find the trail marginally better but still unrideable for our bikes. I have no experience with Pugslys but I still doubt even a fat tired bike would have made it much better than we did. One other guy showed up after us and gave it a try but didn't fare any better than we did. Still to loose. As we sat around the fire after our failed ride we discussed need for something a little heavier to pack the trail down , perhaps a snowmobile! Oh well there's always next wednesday. Thanks to all who did get out and snow shoe though, it all helps. Joe

[crux]

Snow was rather light and fluffy with a slight crust when we were out packing. With the snow this morning it is significantly heavier and more like Sierra concrete and should pack down nice. Think that late Saturday or some time Sunday going to head out with the snowshoes agian and see if conditions will improve.

As for the Pugs they will have a better chance of float. Figure that if you are running a standard tire at 2" compared to a Pug with 4" tread they effectivly cut the PSI in half between the tread and snow allowing the bike to appear only half as heavy (assuming basic math and only looking at force between tire and ground). Will have to get the Three Amigos out on their purple steeds. :D

I'm ready for summer already:jumpy:

[gopherhockey]

There has been some good snowshoe traffic at Leb since the last snow storms, but the trail still isn't packed enough to ride yet.

The X only has seen a few snowshoes and the XX has seen none at all. We can possibly fix that Tuesday night.

[Ubergiant]

Does anyone have any suggestions on way to pack the trails better/faster after snowfalls?
Snowshoes uaully have less than 1 psi of pressure which doesn't pack the snow good enough for the 12 psi or so bikes put out (2 in wide tire, 5 in contact length, 200 lb rider)
Anyone have a skinny sod roller that could be filled up with water and a little antifreeze? If you had a 2 foot wide one with 250 pounds, you could get 5 psi and that would help out...assuming it would roll over the snow and not drag.
Maybe one of those kittycats? Little kid snomobiles? (Snomachine if your canadian)
Just throwin out ideas.

[gopherhockey]

Does anyone have any suggestions on way to pack the trails better/faster after snowfalls?


Been racking my brain over this for the last couple of weeks... snowshoeing is fun and a good workout, but it sure would be nice to be able to pack the trails quickly after a snowfall and then get on out there. As it is our window is going to shrink quickly to ride - once it gets over 40 I'd bet the snow vanishes in less than a week out there enough to close it down again. Would be a shame to never actually have it be packed in enough to ride.

Some kind of small snowmobile or big wheeled minibike would probably be best as long as its not something so small that it too would get stuck.

We thought about just hiking on the trail after snowshoeing, but it would probably rut it up so bad that it might do more harm than good.

[crux]

Been racking my brain over this for the last couple of weeks... snowshoeing is fun and a good workout, but it sure would be nice to be able to pack the trails quickly after a snowfall and then get on out there.

Noticed from the last stomp that the trails was significantly more packed towards the back end of the group. We all just need to reduce the size of our snowshoes to pack it in more or carry a heavy pack. For those attempting to run 2.0 tires on the snow hopefully your following a pug. from the last ride attempt I seemed to be able to ride in the rut of the pug (better than the virgin snow anyway).

[JDEcho]

Been racking my brain over this for the last couple of weeks... snowshoeing is fun and a good workout, but it sure would be nice to be able to pack the trails quickly after a snowfall and then get on out there. As it is our window is going to shrink quickly to ride - once it gets over 40 I'd bet the snow vanishes in less than a week out there enough to close it down again. Would be a shame to never actually have it be packed in enough to ride.

Some kind of small snowmobile or big wheeled minibike would probably be best as long as its not something so small that it too would get stuck.

We thought about just hiking on the trail after snowshoeing, but it would probably rut it up so bad that it might do more harm than good.

Yamaha used to make a small 80cc snomobile called a Sno-Scoot. It was big enough for an adult to ride but very small to manuever in very tight quarters. Anyone have one of these?

[Magic]

Yamaha used to make a small 80cc snomobile called a Sno-Scoot. It was big enough for an adult to ride but very small to manuever in very tight quarters. Anyone have one of these?

The problem with these ideas is they are motorized. I don't think the county would let us use this type of machinery to pack our trails. John can add to this or correct me if I'm wrong.

[KleinCrazy]

Been racking my brain over this for the last couple of weeks... snowshoeing is fun and a good workout, but it sure would be nice to be able to pack the trails quickly after a snowfall and then get on out there. As it is our window is going to shrink quickly to ride - once it gets over 40 I'd bet the snow vanishes in less than a week out there enough to close it down again. Would be a shame to never actually have it be packed in enough to ride.

Some kind of small snowmobile or big wheeled minibike would probably be best as long as its not something so small that it too would get stuck.

We thought about just hiking on the trail after snowshoeing, but it would probably rut it up so bad that it might do more harm than good.

How about a sod roller? Filler with water or sand and towed behind you as you snow shoe the trail? or push infront of you as you snowshoe? Might even work empty, but probably a little to light for that. Might need to texture the surface somehow so it would roll on the snow and not slide. Maybe layer of astroturf or something. Could also work for smoothing our soft dirt or mud ruts in the trail.

Could even fix up to use with a modified BOB hitch behind a pug. or sometype of leadhitch in front of a pug? :etard:

http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/NTESearch?storeId=6970&in_dym=1&Nty=1&D=than&Ntx=mode+matchallpartial&N=0&Ntk=All&Ntt=sod%20roller&cmnosearch=true&cm_ven=PPC&cm_cat=I-search%20(Google%20Adwords)&cm_pla=nt_unproven&cm_ite=sod%20roller

[Ish]

The problem with these ideas is they are motorized. I don't think the county would let us use this type of machinery to pack our trails. John can add to this or correct me if I'm wrong.

How do the xc ski trails get groomed? We're just trying to do the same thing, right?:D

[gopherhockey]

The problem with these ideas is they are motorized. I don't think the county would let us use this type of machinery to pack our trails.

I think we could probably get approval. We have approval to use the Dingo and a 4-wheeler so why not something else. The county uses a snowmobile, maybe we can just get them to run over our trails once. I just think there are areas that might not be suited for a snowmobile (depending on snow depth)


Could even fix up to use with a modified BOB hitch behind a pug. or sometype of leadhitch in front of a pug? :etard:



Heck, if its packed enough to ride a Pugs on the trail then screw pulling something behind - ya'll can wait until we've done a few laps before you ride ;)

Then again my opinion on how "magical" the Pugs are on snow has somewhat changed this winter. Mostly due to poor tire design. (did I say poor, I meant HORRIBLE) It makes me wonder if those who designed it even rode these tires on a real mtb trail. (the way they are designed seems to be for flat trails only with no outslope)

[KleinCrazy]

I know I saw somewhere a Trail Bike (motorized) that was set up to use wide ATV tires. I just can't find it anywhere again and my google search terms for it are not working well.


I know there is something out there, I just need to find it.

[KleinCrazy]

I found one version

Yamaha BW80. late 80's

They also made a BW200 and BW350.

http://www.walnecks.com/search/detail.cfm?ID=84371163

I know I saw one newer with wider tires however.

[gopherhockey]

I found one version

Yamaha BW80. late 80's

They also made a BW200 and BW350.

http://www.walnecks.com/search/detail.cfm?ID=84371163

I know I saw one newer with wider tires however.

Yea, thats the one I had been thinking about... I couldn't find it tho - guess its becuase they haven't made it for a while. Too bad the price seems a bit high. I bet it wold work pretty good (and be a lot of fun too!) people would fight over packing the snow down if we had one of those...

[dave t]

I found one version

Yamaha BW80. late 80's

They also made a BW200 and BW350.

http://www.walnecks.com/search/detail.cfm?ID=84371163

I know I saw one newer with wider tires however.

Honda also made one called the Cub. If I remember it was a 110cc four banger. They had a 70cc 4 wheeler too.

[Pandl]

Honda also had a Trail 70. Looks kind of like the one below. Grew up on one of those in the younger days at the cabin. too bad it was sold years ago.

[tedsti]

http://www.rokon.com/products/trailbrkr.htm

This is what we need.

[nord0306]

I have an old small snowmobile at the cabin that is only about 20" wide, compared to 40" wide modern ones. If I can get it running again, I can store it in Apple Valley at my parents and use it whenever. However, the chances of all that happening before this snow melts is very slim. It does work really well for this type of thing though.

I think in the mean time, the best solution would be smaller snowshoes. If I wore little shoes, like the ones Nita had on, that would work well without rutting too much.

Adam

[DanB]

I think in the mean time, the best solution would be smaller snowshoes. If I wore little shoes, like the ones Nita had on, that would work well without rutting too much.

Adam

Or someone could just ride on Nita's shoulders. :D

[crux]

http://www.ventanausa.com/gallery/3jimjill_ecq_lg.jpgAnother option, non-motorized sure, but could be interesting.

http://www.3wheelerworld.com/images/FatCat1.jpg
How bout the Fat Cat (Yes that is its real name)

[JDEcho]

Honda also had a Trail 70. Looks kind of like the one below. Grew up on one of those in the younger days at the cabin. too bad it was sold years ago.

I have a Honda Trail 70 that I use all year round to run errands on. Northern Tool and most auto parts stores sell a mini-bike with ATV tires on it. It cost about $450 and has a 5 horse 4 stroke motor with a torque converter(fully automatic). Checker Auto by my house sells them.
http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200326636_200326636

[bigwheel]

Kids, suck it up. This is a mountain bike trail. If we can't pack the snow enough to ride it via snowshoes and pugsleys, then we don't belong riding it.

Besides, the problem with the Pugsleys was that the tires were sliding out. The same thing will happen with a fat cat or honda trail 70. The only difference is that with a motorcycle or snowmobile you can put your foo foo drink in the cup holder and drag your feet, rather than use them for pedaling.

If you are going to pack it with a motor vehicle, you may as well ask the overweight snowmobilers to do the job for you.
/RANT

[gopherhockey]

Kids, suck it up. This is a mountain bike trail. If we can't pack the snow enough to ride it via snowshoes and pugsleys, then we don't belong riding it.

Thats kind of like if we can't build a trail without using a mechanized bulldozer to do it, we shouldn't be doing it.... or heck, how about the silly XC skiers and their mechanized groomed trails - what were they thinking making it easy for people to get out and have fun in the snow! :p

http://www.yellowstonetrack.com/admin/images/1universalyts.jpg

No, I don't buy the rant. If finding a way to pack the trail quicker gets us out there riding a week more each winter than I'm all for it... although I admit I won't spend $500 on something to do it... maybe...

We live in Minnesota, people... it can't be THAT hard to come up with something that even Bob would approve of. (maybe we need to promise to put lights on it...) If almost every other winter sport can find a way to ease their pain - from the snowmobile trail compactor to the skate lovers Zamboni... then why can't we. Even Mr. Zamboni had a dream...

/anti-rant ;)

[bigwheel]

The trail around Lake Calhoun is open, if you are looking for mechanized trail grooming.

I agree about the silly groomed XC trails (and groomed snowmobile trails). It would be a shame if our MTB trails evolved into that.

[gopherhockey]

I agree about the silly groomed XC trails (and groomed snowmobile trails). It would be a shame if our MTB trails evolved into that.

This coming from a guy who buys a tractor to terraform the land around his cabin... and I know for a fact he also owns a snow blower as well. Oh the shame! ;)

Yea, its silly to try find a way to have more fun more often in the winter... :p

[Don Youngdahl]

Kids, suck it up. /RANT

Kids, suck it up.
/RANT

I'll rant on the subject also, but with a different twist. Why fight nature when there are easy ways to take what nature gives us? As a serious X-C skier, I solved my snowless winter blues problem by getting studded tires for my mountain bike. When the snow gets too deep for me to ride, that's also exactly the point where there is enough snow for skiing, so I happily put aside the bike for a while. Then of course there's snowshoeing itself, without the "trailwork" motive. Now I don't have to obsess about the weather controlling the sporting activities I love.

The fitness benefits of vigorous X-C skiing or snowshoeing will serve you well when you do get back on the bike.

[gopherhockey]

Why fight nature when there are easy ways to take what nature gives us?

I think the reality is this - we're just thinking outloud and having fun. You and Bob are trying to play the purists and thats ok... but why not let a few people speculate about what might get us back on the trail faster?

We live in Minnesota and there are thousands of people who have invented ways to let us have more fun in the snow doing the sports we love. Its a good thing you two weren't out there poo-pooing all of their ideas.

I bet you ride the ski lift when you go downhill skiing... have you ever been to a hockey game that didn't have a Zamboni to help keep the action on the ice vs. guys with shovels?

I agree.. there are thousands of ways to enjoy winter. I even enjoy snowshowing with my fellow bikers... but why on earth would we stop ourselves from at least having some fun speculating on how we might improve the snow riding situation. Heck, even building a Pugsley wasn't exactly a cheap course of action... we could have kept it to the thinner tires and done something else for a while longer.

Its not for you and thats ok... but don't stop the rest of us from enjoying the many ideas and possibilities. Not everyone has (or wants) some of the other gear required to do other activities available... and certainly if its between the indoor trainer and a winter romp around our favorite trail... I actually envy that you guys like XC skiing, but its just not for me.. tried it, didn't like it.

If nothing comes of it I won't be heart broken... heck, just being allowed to ride at Leb last year was a huge improvement alone. (I remember the days when I had to count down from November 30 to April 15-ish before we could ride Leb again... then someone had the crazy idea of asking permission to ride in the snow)

We could have let Mother nature have her way when it got dark out too... but we found a way around that one fairly easily. I wonder if someone ever told Mr. Nite Rider he should have just found another night activity. (ok, maybe his wife did... doh!)

Its actually not worth the space we've used up ranting about it. We're just having some fun here... and if something serious comes out of it then more power to the bikers! I certainly don't scold Tim and Dale for getting us miles of trail built faster, so I certainly won't stop dreaming up ways to get us back out on those trails and enjoy as much winter riding as possible.

I think if we're seriously going to debate this it should happen in another thread though.

[nord0306]

Kids, suck it up. This is a mountain bike trail. If we can't pack the snow enough to ride it via snowshoes and pugsleys, then we don't belong riding it.

Besides, the problem with the Pugsleys was that the tires were sliding out. The same thing will happen with a fat cat or honda trail 70. The only difference is that with a motorcycle or snowmobile you can put your foo foo drink in the cup holder and drag your feet, rather than use them for pedaling.

If you are going to pack it with a motor vehicle, you may as well ask the overweight snowmobilers to do the job for you.
/RANT

the difference with the motor is the throttle, just let 'er rip, it makes a big rut but who cares, you aren't there anymore...

[gopherhockey]

Now that we buried the actual trail report so deep nobody can see it - back to our regular scheduled program:

Leb is not ready to ride yet. Its still too soft, even after a few dozen snowshoe trips.

We're snowshoeing on Tuesday night to hopefully help it along. We'll be concentrating on the X and XX (which have seen very few tracks) as it seems the intermediate won't improve any with more snowshoe traffic.

Perhaps a bit of melting later in the week will help us out. I just hope it doesn't melt too quickly.

[Ubergiant]

Yes its too soft to ride, I just got back from trying. You'll probably see my tracks veering into the woods here and there.
On a whim, I ventured a couple hundred feet on the hiking trail (it was 9:30, no one was in the park and it was purely to test a hypothesis).
It was a blast! Groomed snow more than a foot wide made it winter mountain biking way more fun, and thats the whole reason why I bought studded tires....fun.
Here's an idea:
We hold a massive bake sale and get this,
http://www.snowgroomers.net/htm/walking.htm (http://www.snowgroomers.net/htm/walking.htm)
Then find a trail wide enough to use it on (Salem?) and someone volunteer to drag it around with an ATV or snomobile when needed with the understanding that others who use the trail will buy said volunteer beer.
I bet a lot more people would ride under those circumstances and there wouldn't be as much damage to Leb in the spring thaw.

[Pandl]

Oh sorry, I see you were trying to get back to the regular scheduled program, but I digress:

I am a snowmobiler, and not overweight. And, I think they groom the snowmobile trails to keep the trail all snowcovered, and move snow from the corners where it gets pushed out, and back onto the trail. i would much rather ride an ungroomed fresh snow trail than a groomed trail, any day.

Bake sale. Cool. I like to bake, people love my cookies. Sign me up. :banana:

Have a GREAT time tonite 'shoeing.

[gopherhockey]

i would much rather ride an ungroomed fresh snow trail than a groomed trail, any day.



I would too, as long as the trail is packed down enough to ride. We're not talking about blazing a 6' wide groomed trail here - we're just speculating on what we could do (even manually) to better pack the trails down. Its actually the difference between NOT riding the trail (too soft), or riding the trail (packed sufficiently) - not one of appearance.

I used to ride a snowmobile as well, and I hated groomed trails. I snowboard and hate groomed trails. I'm with ya...

I wouldn't want anything driving around Leb that would hurt the trees or put down a trail so wide it wouldn't look like singletrack in the snow.

Back to trail conditions... still unridable, hopefully this will change in the next few days.

[dave t]

If enough people walk it with just boots then it won't be too bumpy. Look at the hiking trails. They are usually packed in a few days.

At a good winter tire pressure, you shouldn't even feel a footprint.

[Don Youngdahl]

If enough people walk it with just boots then it won't be too bumpy. Look at the hiking trails. They are usually packed in a few days.

This is the second post I've seen on this thread that points out the trail packing benefits of hikers, and it matches my experience on the trails I ride in the winter.

So how about opening the mountain biking trails to hikers in the winter? And perhaps go one step further and close or find a way to discourage hikers from using the hiking trails in the winter.

John, be assured this is not a negative or sarcastic comment on the struggle to make trails ridable all winter, just some random thoughts based on my experience, which may or may not be practical to implement.

[Ubergiant]

Keep in mind that the designated hiking trails at Leb are groomed the same way/time the skate trails are.

[gopherhockey]

So how about opening the mountain biking trails to hikers in the winter? And perhaps go one step further and close or find a way to discourage hikers from using the hiking trails in the winter.

John, be assured this is not a negative or sarcastic comment on the struggle to make trails ridable all winter, just some random thoughts based on my experience, which may or may not be practical to implement.

I'm actually not completely against hikers on the trail in the winter. The bikers are moving slower, and trail conflicts are going to be minimized. In fact I've put a lot of thought into hiking as being the next logical step toward a packed down trail. Snowshoe Stomp -> Hiker Stomp -> Ride.

The problem is I'm not entirely convinced that foot traffic is all good. Salem, for example, gets very difficult to ride under certain situations because of the foot traffic it gets. If the entire trail were packed completely it would be one thing, but a few random prints will not be all that easy to ride.

I'm not convinced either way really. My gut tells me its best to keep the hikers used to staying off the MTB trail so we don't have to educate that group on staying off the trail when we've put up the orange fences, or let them know that at a certain time of the year they need to get off and stay off. I'd almost rather they just stick to their trails and if we need foot traffic we do it ourselves. (on the flip side we need to stay off their trails as well, even if they are packed in better than ours. I often feel hikers are a more mature group than bikers as a whole when it comes to following signs and rules)

Its definitely a good debate, one that I can go back and forth on pretty easily. I don't currently go out of my way to tell a hiker to get off the trail when its packed with snow, but I only encourage snowshoers to use the trail.

I'm not a huge fan of pet doo-doo left on the trails regardless of the user group. This is one hugely inconsiderate group (pet owners, not the pets) and another reason why I lean toward not promoting foot traffic in the winter... it just means crap in our chains come spring. :crazy2: :sick:

[ryno lite]

Why are you guys so worried? A few more days and winter will be over anyway! Another few weeks and we will be starting the best 7 month stretch of the year! I can't wait for dirt singletrack, shorts, and warm weather!
:banana: :banana: :banana:

[Fast1]

Why are you guys so worried? A few more days and winter will be over anyway! Another few weeks and we will be starting the best 7 month stretch of the year! I can't wait for dirt singletrack, shorts, and warm weather!
:banana: :banana: :banana:


now that is stepping back and looking at the big picture

[gopherhockey]

Another few weeks and we will be starting the best 7 month stretch of the year!

But why limit yourself to 7 months... I've been enjoying the best 11.5 months of the year by riding all winter long ;)

[Fast1]

But why limit yourself to 7 months... I've been enjoying the best 11.5 months of the year by riding all winter long ;)


it is a bit easier when it doesn't snow until late Feb and early Mar

maybe planning for next year would be the best objective

[gopherhockey]

We tried riding Leb last night on the Pugsleys. Even the fat tires couldn't make very good progress on the trail. Snowshoes have packed it in, but it just seems too soft to ride still. There just isn't enough of a crust forming, and its fairly soft under the top layer.

Seeing warm weather ahead, I highly doubt we'll get back out there again for any serious riding. We will monitor the situation, but its starting to get to that time where we bring out the orange fences and button up the trail for the spring melt.

I would say anyone trying to ride the trail in the next week will end up walking over 95% of it.

[bigwheel]

Tuesday Mar 13. Leb is officially closed.

Dakota County locked the gate to the parking lot, and put up the red fences. The entire area is a swamp. The trail will now stay closed until it dries completely, which is typically mid to end of April.

Please avoid the temptation to ride the trail while it is closed.

[gopherhockey]

As Bob previously mentioned, Lebanon Hills is CLOSED. This means all trails as well as the parking lot. Even hiking is prohibited at this time.

This year at Leb we are putting up more orange fences than usual. The fences we do put up are strung out wider to help avoid the usual ride or walk-arounds. Fences are also placed in areas that aren't just entrances to the trail... this is to try send the message that poaching will be no fun as you'll end up having to get off your bike. We will probably lock up the teeter and perhaps find other ways to block obstacles. Orange fences have more real looking "Trail Closed" signs provided by Dakota County... you know, just in case the orange fence wasn't obvious enough. The parking lot at Leb is also closed, but often gets re-opened for hikers much earlier than our bike trails are ready.

We hope to contact Parks Patrol this year to partner with them for more eyes watching the lot and the trails.

Hopefull when it starts to get into serious poaching time we can organize a bit and take turns watching our trail like we have in the past. I think this can be done in a way that is in cooperation with the Parks Patrol, who are the only ones that do the actual ticketing and enforcement.

[bigwheel]

I have a battery powered electric fence zapper that I'm willing to loan to MORC. Maybe a mild shock would help provide some negative reinforcement to poachers.

[DanB]

As Bob previously mentioned, Lebanon Hills is CLOSED. This means all trails as well as the parking lot. Even hiking is prohibited at this time.

This year at Leb we are putting up more orange fences than usual. The fences we do put up are strung out wider to help avoid the usual ride or walk-arounds. Fences are also placed in areas that aren't just entrances to the trail... this is to try send the message that poaching will be no fun as you'll end up having to get off your bike. We will probably lock up the teeter and perhaps find other ways to block obstacles. Orange fences have more real looking "Trail Closed" signs provided by Dakota County... you know, just in case the orange fence wasn't obvious enough. The parking lot at Leb is also closed, but often gets re-opened for hikers much earlier than our bike trails are ready.

We hope to contact Parks Patrol this year to partner with them for more eyes watching the lot and the trails.

Hopefull when it starts to get into serious poaching time we can organize a bit and take turns watching our trail like we have in the past. I think this can be done in a way that is in cooperation with the Parks Patrol, who are the only ones that do the actual ticketing and enforcement.

Just to be clear this means we're not supposed to ride Leb right??? ;) :D

[crux]

We hope to contact Parks Patrol this year to partner with them for more eyes watching the lot and the trails.

Hopefull when it starts to get into serious poaching time we can organize a bit and take turns watching our trail like we have in the past. I think this can be done in a way that is in cooperation with the Parks Patrol, who are the only ones that do the actual ticketing and enforcement.

Have enough remote cameras to wire leb, how many eyes did you want watching the place agian?

[gopherhockey]

Just a reminder...

Nice weather is starting to get everyone thinking about riding.

There is still snow on the ground and we're still weeks away though.. please realize that we are shooting for a beginning of May opening date, and anything earlier is a bonus. Realistically we're talking mid-April.

60s and 70s doesn't mean trails are dry. Have some good road riding and thanks for your patience!

[bikeoutback]

When I rode by last night the orange fence on the Galaxie side was completely in tact and didn't appear to have been messed with at all. I was gonna check for tracks but it was dark out when I was on my way back and I didn't have lights so getting home was the priority at the time. If I get a chance to ride by there this weekend I'll check then. There was still pretty good amount of snow in the woods though as I could see while riding. Lucky for me the pavement is at least dry ;)

[gopherhockey]

When I rode by last night the orange fence on the Galaxie side was completely in tact and didn't appear to have been messed with at all. I was gonna check for tracks but it was dark out when I was on my way back and I didn't have lights so getting home was the priority at the time. If I get a chance to ride by there this weekend I'll check then. There was still pretty good amount of snow in the woods though as I could see while riding. Lucky for me the pavement is at least dry ;)

It helps to have people keeping their eyes out for the fences being taken down.

The one over on Galaxie by the actual road is more for looks. There are clear paths around it. Back in where our trail crosses the ski/hiking areas we have better fences. We have tried putting up better fencing on the Galaxie side but hikers seem to feel they are exempt from the rules and will cut the fences.

We're putting up MORE fences this weekend as well. Anyone poaching will not enjoy their ride this spring. :p :cool:

[SPR]

...

We're putting up MORE fences this weekend as well. Anyone poaching will not enjoy their ride this spring. :p :cool:
Curious on how the trail is looking with this thawing. Not for riding but how the trail held up especially the new sections after this winter. Did you get out this weekend to install more fencing?

[gopherhockey]

Curious on how the trail is looking with this thawing. Not for riding but how the trail held up especially the new sections after this winter. Did you get out this weekend to install more fencing?

I haven't actually seen the trail recently. We got some additional fencing put up, but could use some more.

When it gets into the 70s like this people's brains turn off and they start heading out to the trail... hopefully it will be cooler and rainy on the weekends up to opening time like it was last year - that tends to cut down on the poaching.

[Danimal]

I am waiting on the good word before I head out... anxiously waiting John... anxiously waiting.

[bikeoutback]

I am waiting on the good word before I head out... anxiously waiting John... anxiously waiting.

I think you'll be anxiously waiting for a couple of weeks as of last saturday there was still little pockets of snow visible in the woods when I went by on Galaxie.

[gopherhockey]

I think you'll be anxiously waiting for a couple of weeks as of last saturday there was still little pockets of snow visible in the woods when I went by on Galaxie.

Yup... sure feels like one could ride being 82 degrees out doesn't it? We're still 2 weeks away at the very least and there is rain on the way.

If it were to stay well above like this we'd be earlier than normal, but that still probably means at least a week into April.

Mid-April is still my guess. HOpe people can really be patient... remember, frost isn't visible to the eye and thats what we're the most worried about. Dry doesn't even necessarily mean dry if there is still frost under the covers.

[ryno lite]

I can guarantee you that the trails need 2-3 weeks. I was in a metro park this past Saturday on MORC business and the trails on the north sides of hills were still frozen solid and the south facing trails were a greasy mess on top of frost. There was even some snow. I'm sure the past couple of days have helped, but the frost in the ground is still there and the ground temp is cold. It is going to take some time. The trails wouldn't even be fun right now because of the conditions, so go out and have a nice road ride this week to get those legs ready for when the mtn bike trails open up!

[Danimal]

:( I wait :(

[crux]

I can guarantee you that the trails need 2-3 weeks. I was in a metro park this past Saturday on MORC business and the trails on the north sides of hills were still frozen solid and the south facing trails were a greasy mess on top of frost. There was even some snow. I'm sure the past couple of days have helped, but the frost in the ground is still there and the ground temp is cold. It is going to take some time. The trails wouldn't even be fun right now because of the conditions, so go out and have a nice road ride this week to get those legs ready for when the mtn bike trails open up!

Second that. Went on some trail sections this past weekend sans bike and it is going to take some time for things to thaw and dry out. Best thing right now would be some warm rain followed by high temps and wind to dry things out. Still seeing sections of snow in shady parts that are going to take their time to dry out. Want to get the play bike out on the trails.

John how you holding up with that new BMC waiting for dirt?

[gopherhockey]

John how you holding up with that new BMC waiting for dirt?

:cryin: :jumpy: :cool: :p :sick:

That about says it all I think.

[tedsti]

Don't kid yourself people, the ground is NOT frozen and rideable at Leb. I checked it out yesterday and the ground was still soft and I was leaving footprints. The gates are still closed (Thanks Dakota Co.!!!!!!), and all trails are closed. Hopefully we can get past this cold snap and get back on the trail soon. See you on the paved trails.

[gopherhockey]

Briefly checked the trails today just to see where we're at. They appear to be drying on the parking lot side, but are still quite wet on the Galaxie side. There is still snow out there, and the trail has some nasty ruts in it now from poaching.

Don't expect Leb to open up this weekend or anytime next week. We'll re-evaluate for next weekend. We're kind of starting over with the dring now so please continue to be patient and spread the word to your buddies that the trail is still not open and isn't even close.

The damage done by the poacher was extensive and has created more work for the volunteers. If anyone has even the most remote question about why we close the trails and why we get so upset when people ignore trail closures let me know and I will take you out and show you first hand what kind of damage it does.

[gopherhockey]

Bob, Ted and I hiked out at leb today to check things out. We're still at least a week away I'm afraid.

The rut I saw extended down most of the trail as far as we could tell. Ted got some pictures of some serious damage done. If it rains before we get in there and fix the ruts we're going to have even worse damage.

Lets hope it gets into the 60s for a while. We'll re-evaluate as the week progresses.

[jeffgude]

Bob, Ted and I hiked out at leb today to check things out. We're still at least a week away I'm afraid.

The rut I saw extended down most of the trail as far as we could tell. Ted got some pictures of some serious damage done. If it rains before we get in there and fix the ruts we're going to have even worse damage.

Lets hope it gets into the 60s for a while. We'll re-evaluate as the week progresses.


Have you broken in that BMC yet?

[tedsti]

As was posted earlier by John, we walked part of the trail to see how things are progressing. Here is some damage done by someone poaching the trail. These were taken on the Intermediate and the X-loop. This is why we get all crabby when it comes to poachers. This damage is going to take a lot of work to fix. This is effort that could be much better spent on new trail.

http://www.morcmtb.org/photopost/data/513/medium/Leb_Rut_1.jpg
http://www.morcmtb.org/photopost/showphoto.php?photo=4089&size=big&cat=513


http://www.morcmtb.org/photopost/data/513/medium/Leb_Rut_3.jpg
http://www.morcmtb.org/photopost/showphoto.php?photo=4088&size=big&cat=513


http://www.morcmtb.org/photopost/data/513/medium/Leb_Rut_2.jpg
http://www.morcmtb.org/photopost/showphoto.php?photo=4087&size=big&cat=513

[timmy]

I hope the person or persons that did that get their bikes stolen!! What a bunch of a**holes!!!:mad:

[bovaddict]

lack of knowledge is excusable to small extent
arrogance is different..

regardless common sence>

[gopherhockey]

Other trails are opening (Salem, Theo..) but we still need a day or two. Looks like it won't be long.

Please be patient. Good things come to those who wait.

[gopherhockey]

Bob and I checked out the trails at Leb tonight. The north facing side is still pretty wet. There are also two large trees down out there that we need to clear out before we open.

Tomorrow we're walking the trails with Dakota County to scope out for national trails day. I hope poachers come along tomorrow... :fool: :D

At least another full day of drying necessary.. maybe more. Stay tuned.

[Danimal]

Goodie! Goodie! Let us know please! Pretty Please!

[bikeoutback]

Hopefully there is an update later on tonight that says OPEN so I can try and get a ride in there tomorrow morning before work. What time is the park legally open?

[gopherhockey]

THE TRAIL IS OPEN!!!!

Get out and ride... we just opened it up.

Please, if you can, ride and stomp down those ruts... seriously, the more you can pack down the ruts the better. Make a game out of it...

Enjoy!

[Danimal]

Crap! I gotta work tonight! :banghead::banghead: :banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

[mikemarken]

man, looking at some of those pictures taken at leb makes me drool! cant wait!:jumpy:

[gopherhockey]

The trail is starting to pack down already. Its still tacky in many areas, and the ruts are still there... get out and ride, help us pack the ruts down and firm up the trail before spring rains hit.

Enjoy!

[deepindakotacounty]

FYI - about 500 feet before beginner loop on the intermediate trail, right after the little wide bridge, I noticed two kids (13-15) sitting on the trail, taking a breather. When I came across to where there were sitting I noticed a rock in the trail (cantaloupe sized). I stopped because it looked out of place, and glancing to the side of the track there was a fresh outline of where a rock that size should be. I put the rock back and went on my merry way. Just another example of some riders that just don't care.

[tns1972]

FYI - about 500 feet before beginner loop on the intermediate trail, right after the little wide bridge, I noticed two kids (13-15) sitting on the trail, taking a breather. When I came across to where there were sitting I noticed a rock in the trail (cantaloupe sized). I stopped because it looked out of place, and glancing to the side of the track there was a fresh outline of where a rock that size should be. I put the rock back and went on my merry way. Just another example of some riders that just don't care.

I may have seen those same boys cutting the trail in the usual spot, towards the end of the x. There were a total of 4 I saw riding together at about 4:30. I told them they had to stay on the trail, Dakota County is watching, we could lose trail, riders come flying down that section, blah, blah, blah. I got the feeling the 2 I talked to had been confronted before. No helmets, two on BMX, two on rigid 26".

It appeared that the side hill they cut down was showing damage, and the fence was down. What do you do?

[sakmeister]

First time out this year! The trail was in good shape yesterday. A few damp spots, but I expected a lot more in the valley. My only complaint was the kid who was riding with his dog (golden retriever I believe). The dog was on a leash, but the kid wasn't holding on to it and I had a heck of a time trying to pass without the dog running in front of me.

[dopey048]

Great conditions this morning. Can't remember the name of the guy I talked to this morning at the X entrance. Good to see someone else out there that I know.

[Aaroneous]

I just got back, and it was so nice... My first dirt ride of the year... ahh... all is right with the world...

[soupboy]

Trail was great today. Perfect day for breaking in the new steed. Only rut I noticed was on the newer section of the longer climb in the middle. Gotta get my sea legs back.

[toddj]

Great conditions this morning. Can't remember the name of the guy I talked to this morning at the X entrance. Good to see someone else out there that I know.
Gabe - it was nice to see a familiar face riding out there this morning. I am looking forward to starting trail maintenance soon! See you then.

[trompete]

Is the trail going to be ridable tomorrow after today's rain??

[crux]

Rained pretty good down here this afternoon, not sure if the trail is going to be closed or not, but would at least give it a day or two to dry out.

Hopefully one of the dirt bosses will post up if they are not having to much fun in Frutia.

[tedsti]

I should be OK late tomorrow. Give it til late afternoon at least.

Is the trail going to be ridable tomorrow after today's rain??

[bikeoutback]

I know it was raining pretty good when I went to sleep around 1am last night about a mile from Leb, think it will be alright to ride tonight say around 7pm or hold off till tomorrow?

[Hathor]

I'll try to run over there this afternoon and check it out. Will report when I get back.

[Hathor]

All right. My friend just got back from hiking and said the hiking trails are bone dry and that there are tons of people biking. I am going to be optimistic that this means these people know what they are doing and the bike trail is also good. Going out there with my bike to see for myself!

[Hathor]

My first ride of the season so my legs and lungs are kinda wondering "WTF?" Anyway, the trail is in pretty good condition. The only thing a little bit borderline is the X (as per usual), so please tread lightly if you go on it. XX is good. The parking was filliing up fast when I left.

[trompete]

Trail is in good shape. Dream and dream 2 are tacky. X is soft/tacky as expected.

[gmargolf]

Was out this morning, less tacky than it was last week, alot of fun. Some guy in blue jeans was riding his bike everywhere except on the bike path???:crazy2: Why, I am not sure.

[waitabit]

Trail is perfect right now!

who hit the rabbit at the beginning of the XX loop?Theres gray fur all over the trail.:laugh:

[bikeoutback]

Trail is perfect right now!

who hit the rabbit at the beginning of the XX loop?Theres gray fur all over the trail.:laugh:

The rocks are still hard too. :crazy:

[tedsti]

There is a low tree on the X-out. I cleared the eye-pokers, but did not have a big enough saw to clear the tree. It is not any lower than some of the other ones that are out there.

[bovaddict]

im going after some work thing tomorrow for my first time ive been going to theo alot but ive wanted to go here.. so ya hopefully see you guys tomorrow and hopefully the directions i got will get me there from my work meeting in bloomington..

[gopherhockey]

After yesterday's rain please give the trail a bit to dry off today. Should be ready by afternoon.

[herbiederby21]

"I did post on another thread but it seems to be dead"

My first real lap timed?!
<HR style="COLOR: #cccccc" SIZE=1><!-- / icon and title --><!-- message -->I've never timed myself out here... So is this how it is... a REAL lap?... Inter, X, Tedmans, inter, XX, inter out... ? All technical spots hit except for the log after the table in the XX?

Well anyways... I'd like to try a race or two early this year and my time was officially 37:49.

Any suggestions for races to sign up for? Do we have any technical style races in MN, or will the featherweight hardtails leave me in the dust with anything I sign up for?

I know I'll get faster as the next couples weeks go by, still outta shape from thinking snowboarding kept me in shape!

Thanks
<!-- / message -->

[trompete]

Hi Andrew. A dead thread is a dead thread. This one is about trail conditions, and lots of us get email every time it's updated.

[bovaddict]

i didnt go out today because this morning it seemed damp adn now that im back home i wont be driving back there today.. this weekend assuming no more storms ill be there though 100%

[bowmanmark]

Trail is rideable we were out at 12:00 and there were just a few small puddles to watch out for. Otherwise the trail is great

[gopherhockey]

Rain is coming own with more on the way this weekend. Doesn't look like good conditions to ride Leb. Pls let things dry out before riding...

Leb was VERY dry before the rain. We have some rocks that have already come loose and are lying in random spots on the trail. Please be careful out there until we can put the rocks back where they belong.

Saw lots of skidding evidence during yesterday's ride as well. Most are probably skidiots, but some are probably people pushing a bit too hard early in the season. Pls keep your bike under control... we don't want to rack up an injury list like last year.

Enjoy the road riding this weekend....

[phaberman1]

Anyone been out there this morning? I can't believe that less than 1/10th of an inch yesterday would leave the trail in non rideable condition today.

[ibismojo2001]

Drove throught the lot and lots of folks there but everyone I talked to had yet to go out there. ??????

[gopherhockey]

Anyone been out there this morning? I can't believe that less than 1/10th of an inch yesterday would leave the trail in non rideable condition today.

I'd guess its just fine as well. The rain stopped and it seems to have changed direction a bit... at least for now.

[James]

Just got back, rode In-X-XX-X-Out.
I did see some rutting on the last quarter of the Int. trail (maybe someone riding last night or very early today) The rest of the trail is solid and should be fine to ride today barring more rain.

[stoneage]

Here it comes. one ten

[gopherhockey]

Yup, now the rain comes that I thought was going to hit us last night.

.21" and counting. We need the rain tho.

[bovaddict]

ya we do.. otherwise id make it indoors,im dying to go back!!!!

[Chug]

Think its dry enough to ride this morning??????????????

[Chug]

Never mind...........I just checked the radar and if it is not raining there, and here, yet...... it will be soon enough.

[gopherhockey]

Think its dry enough to ride this morning??????????????

I think you could sneak in a lap or two... but I think rain is headed our way again. It was sprinkling a bit already this morning.

Its tough to tell this week - it rains, then stops and is windy so it probably dries up fast. So far I don't think we've had enough to make it bad for riding.

Never mind...........I just checked the radar and if it is not raining there, and here, yet...... it will be soon enough.

Yea, if you aren't a few miles from the trail it might not be worth the drive... good call.

[Chug]

I'd be better off trying to hit Theo, it is only about a mile from here. I really don't want to make the drive all the way out to Leb and then get rained on.

[bovaddict]

^yup.. what im gonna do :(

[gopherhockey]

Trail was damp today... some low lying spots needing fixing are holding a bit of mud. There were thousands of small and medium branches down on the trail due to the recent high winds. Took an extra 30 minutes to do each lap in order to do some cleanup.

There is a tree down on the beginner trail (first half).

There is also a BIG tree down on the Dream trail downhill section - its in a very bad spot, so please watch for it. Its in the first downhill section after you do the trail with the monster log pile. (the long swooping downhill) Its right around a corner, so use caution.

[bovaddict]

when will clean up be? weather permitting ill show up tomorrow and if my car gets fied..(its broke today.. SOOO upset) but then started later after it got towed home.. who knows its a euro. anyway lmk!

[Chug]

How much rain you get down there this morning? Theo was perfect yesterday and will probably be fine in a few hours, that is, if the rain holds off again...

[gopherhockey]

How much rain you get down there this morning? Theo was perfect yesterday and will probably be fine in a few hours, that is, if the rain holds off again...

Weatherbug shows about .06" Not bad alone, but the trail was already damp. If it doesn't rain anymore I'd think it would be ok by this afternoon.

Again, watch for downed trees etc. I'm going to try get out there today to remove the one on the dream trail downhill - its in a real dangerous spot.

[Chug]

Bah...... the Boss put the lock down on going to Leb. Something about getting something done by a certain time. Looks like its more speed laps at Theo.
Man, when is that new section going to be done? (theo)

[gopherhockey]

The trees that were down on the trail at Leb have now been removed. I don't know if any others fell last night so I can't guarantee the trail is fully cleared, but at least the two bad ones we knew about have been removed.

Looked a little damp out there. One rider came off the trail with some mud.

Brought back a few ticks.. nice reward...

[gopherhockey]

Its been raining on and off down south of the metro. .33" so far and its coming down pretty hard now. Hope nobody is out on the trail or they will be soaked bike by the time they get out.

We do need the rain though... let it come...

[crux]

8 pm and quite a few bikers out on the trail from the looks of it in the lot.

[bovaddict]

cant wait to go.. i get off work at 3 tomorrow anychance it will be good then?

[gopherhockey]

cant wait to go.. i get off work at 3 tomorrow anychance it will be good then?

I'd guess it will be ok. We're getting small doses of rain here and there and its going to start adding up soon if we don't get some sun. Looks like we'll get some of that tomorrow.

[bovaddict]

i live in wayzata.. ill check here before i leave.. lets hope

[jholiday]

Anyone been out to Leb today? I'm thinking of going in a bit and was wondering if it is dry enough to ride.

J

[gopherhockey]

Anyone been out to Leb today? I'm thinking of going in a bit and was wondering if it is dry enough to ride.

J

We've had some good sun today. I'd hit the trails and report back... I'm guessing its just damp to tacky.

[jholiday]

Just got back and yeah, damp & tacky is about right. The corners were still pretty slick so it was a slower ride for me, I'd rather stay upright at this point in my life.

[bovaddict]

ill wait another day then :(..

[stoneage]

4 PM had a few mucky puddles in cupped corners, but nothing too bad. Like they say, 99.9% OK. First time out this year. Very nice.

[[defective]]

Tree down in XX. Really bad spot. Just after what is probably the fastest XX stretch.

Immediately after the hillside rock garden, the trail bends to the left and you can open up on the fast downhill which rolls back up and takes a couple of smooth turns. The tree is down just after the second curve left and you don't see it until you're almost on it. Shortly after the tree is the first XX ravine bridge, the one with the boulder on the far side.

[gopherhockey]

Raining cats and dogs right now. Probably enough to end any Wed. morning ride plans.

Watch that tree Scott was talking about. Sounds like its just after what we call the "catwalk climb" in the XX loop just before the first bridge.

[bovaddict]

CARS FIXED! going tomorrow assuming its beautiful out

[trompete]

Please post up if you check out the trail tomorrow morning. I'm hoping for a lunch ride.

[bovaddict]

ill test the irt around my place before i leave.. otherwise its another day.. so well hpe its dried out but it really rained here last night

[bowmanmark]

I am looking to go ride in tommorow. i would think the trail should be dry by then .

[robc]

Anyone been out to the trail today over lunch? Whats it look like? I was planning on coming down this afternoon/evening, but want to avoid the trip from the northland if its a no-go.

Thanks!
Rob

[gopherhockey]

I haven't seen or heard anything, but if Theo is too wet I'm guessing Leb is too wet as well. We've had pockets of rain every day and its adding up.

Safe bet is to wait until tomorrow (Thursday) - especially if you're driving from far enough away to hate the thought of turning around and going home without getting in a ride. Should be drying up nicely as we speak.

[Trevize1138]

Brent went out to check it over his lunch break. He works just a few miles from the trail.

[trompete]

I just got back. I'd say close it until tomorrow. It's already been poached enough today.

Dream II had lots of slicks and ruts from this morning. X was as bad as usual, with a couple standing ponds to walk over. X-out was worse with hidden slicks, one of which I wiped out on (sorry about the rut if I left one. I'll make it up with more trail work). Dream was mostly OK, but the last descent after the big climb was slick as well.

I'd say close it for a day. We left for work at 1:15 PM, and things were still bad.

Brent

[gopherhockey]

(sorry about the rut if I left one. I'll make it up with more trail work).

Holy... if everyone were like you, we'd have it made. Thats worth rep points for sure!

[bowmanmark]

Trails are in good shape just 1 wet spot right before you get to the parking lot.

[bovaddict]

ill try and make it this weekend and if trail work is needed ill help out no prob.. car still isnt working :( today was just beautiful so im assuming tomorrow/saturday it should be perfect?

[Trevize1138]

It's about in perfect shape right now. A few dusty spots in the usual exposed, sunny spots but overall it's really nice and tacky!

[Ubergiant]

HEY!
Our little trail is famous.
On the REI website, they have a video trying to sell one of their full suspension bikes and almost all of it was filmed at Lebanon. The tabletop, parking lot and a few other turns are on there.
http://www.rei.com/novara
Click on "LAUNCH NOVARA FLiCKS" and its the "METHOD 2.0" movie on the right. REI did a photo shoot last summer at leb for the 07 bike catalog and aperantly they took some video as well.
Yes this post is pertinent trail conditions because Lebanon just went from a local condition to national.

[Uncle Leo]

HEY!
Our little trail is famous.
On the REI website, they have a video trying to sell one of their full suspension bikes and almost all of it was filmed at Lebanon. The tabletop, parking lot and a few other turns are on there.
http://www.rei.com/novara
Click on "LAUNCH NOVARA FLiCKS" and its the "METHOD 2.0" movie on the right. REI did a photo shoot last summer at leb for the 07 bike catalog and aperantly they took some video as well.
Yes this post is pertinent trail conditions because Lebanon just went from a local condition to national.


I see, so you're supposed to JUMP Jan's rock!
I gotta say, I never thought of that.
I guess things start to look a little smaller when you have those kind of skills.
Nice videos - thanks for the link.

[bovaddict]

went last 2 days(gf drove since my cars been broken) and had a blast going again EARLY tomorrow morning.. soo pumped :) im going to mammoth tuesday ngiht so ill see how they compare.. but ya.. conditions have been great.. hot and a little harder/sweatier but great!

[robc]

Can anyone near Leb post up on the weather? Was there any rain down there that would stop an afternoon ride today?

Thanks!
Rob

[gopherhockey]

Can anyone near Leb post up on the weather? Was there any rain down there that would stop an afternoon ride today?

Thanks!
Rob

Nope.. ride away! Should be good out there... watch for twigs and potential trees as the winds have been high again.

[bowmanmark]

yup trails are in good shape

[robc]

Thanks for the update guys! I am looking forward to a nice cool afternoon ride!

-R

[Troy and Spokes]

I just did a few laps and the trail couldn't have been any more perfect! No wet spots and there is no debris on the trail even with the high winds today.

[gopherhockey]

Quick update: there is an area we call the "upper bypass" on the Intermediate trail that brings you up through some rocks (highest point of Lebanon Hills) just before you drop down to the common area in front of the X loop.

Anyway.. this turned out to be more expert than Intermediate, so an easy bypass was constructed tonight. This will allow intermediate riders to skip the rocks if they wish, or take the rocks if they want added challenge.

There were a few small areas fixed in the XX as well tonight - cleared out around some of the logs, etc. We even made a rolling jump out of one of the logs just after the first bridge that used to just kind of sit on its own... its where that one girl busted up her face the day before her wedding. (and someone I know broke a frame). Anyway, it should roll better now.

... dumbing down the trail, one step at a time... ;)

[crux]

... dumbing down the trail, one step at a time... ;)

Next week we will have to take care of that rock as well.:banana:
Might want to invite Buck to take his bike in to test it during the trail session.

[gopherhockey]

Did anyone notice anything strange about the X loop today? Like logs out of place?

[bakkeb]

I noticed a lot of little changes today. The best one was the change to the log in the way after dropping off a log right after the first of the two bridges in the XX loop. It's now a pretty good little jump after the first drop. I've never had a problem with it, but I know some people who also have had problems with it. I will say the flow was a little interupted before and now it is perfect! Great job! Now if we can get that large rock removed from the XX loop that slows your speed down fairly close to the entrance. It looks like a shark tooth sticking out of the ground. Since it has been installed, I've hated it. I did notice a few rocks and logs missing this time around.:etard:

[[defective]]

Now if we can get that large rock removed from the XX loop that slows your speed down fairly close to the entrance. It looks like a shark tooth sticking out of the ground. Since it has been installed, I've hated it.

Seconded. That section had been such a sweet child. Now, it's an acne scarred teen smoking kools behind the kum'n'go. His tongue in stained blue from slurpee dye. He raps poorly, and with a cracking voice.

[bovaddict]

ok^

and by dumbing down you mean less challenging or more/same challenging but smoother?

[gopherhockey]

ok^

and by dumbing down you mean less challenging or more/same challenging but smoother?

We're a little off topic.. but I think I over-stated the dumbing down thing. It was more of a joke (based on responses of the past)

The cool thing is that we are now able to make the trail safer without necessarily removing challenge. The upper bypass now has a good route for those who are learning, but the old route is still there. I was really happy because I sat there for 30 minutes after finishing waiting for someone to take the new easy line but nobody would. "hey guys, try this new easy line.." "no thanks dude, I like the rocks!" :D

A lot of the repair on the logs was cleaning out debris, so for the most part that = harder. We're just evil that way. ;)

Back to trail conditions - its already starting to get overgrown out there. I don't know what kind of weed it is - some kind of mustard or something, but its growing into the trail and really taking away visibility. We'll hopefully get out there and trim the weeds back early June.

[Buck]

Back to trail conditions - its already starting to get overgrown out there. I don't know what kind of weed it is - some kind of mustard or something, but its growing into the trail and really taking away visibility. We'll hopefully get out there and trim the weeds back early June.

Hey John! I don't if it can be done this way but on one of my many days off, I would gladily spend my day out there weed whippin'. I'd just need to get the weed whipper from someone.

Let me know!
weRd!
Buck

[gopherhockey]

Hey John! I don't if it can be done this way but on one of my many days off, I would gladily spend my day out there weed whippin'. I'd just need to get the weed whipper from someone.



You're going to regret volunteering for this... ;)

I'm going to get the new trimmer through Tim soon and we'll get things rolling. If a few people were to take shifts we could trim it all out in no time. I did it all myself last year and my back is still screaming at me.

[mara]

If a few people were to take shifts we could trim it all out in no time.

I volunteer to help if I can do it with a scythe instead of a machine :D

[Buck]

You're going to regret volunteering for this... ;)

I'm going to get the new trimmer through Tim soon and we'll get things rolling. If a few people were to take shifts we could trim it all out in no time. I did it all myself last year and my back is still screaming at me.

I figure three cans of Red Bull would get me through the whole trail in under 8hrs. :jumpy: If ya want it done before national trail day let me know, believe me I've got the time.

weRd!
Buck

[gopherhockey]

I volunteer to help if I can do it with a scythe instead of a machine :D

Hey, non-gas powered equipment use is always a bonus! :p

[crux]

John, that is a polite way of asking about the X section.

Really like how the sarcastic humor is taken out of context as well.

If your looking for a hand I have tomorrow afternoon free. Would be willing to trim a bit of the weeds and if we could get a pulaski will take care of that rock as well.;)

(For selfish reason want to get this don't before I find out about the job.)

[manual63]

Hey, non-gas powered equipment use is always a bonus! :p

Yep, mara is better powered by :beer_yum::beer_yum::beer_yum::beer_yum::beer_yum:

[bovaddict]

i went out today, trail was different thats for sure.. gf is getting a new bike and coming out soon though we start our search tomorrow :)

anyway i got a lot more air off tha tfirst drop off on the first expert section.. and after today i have finsihed my excuses on not owning clip ins so im getting those tomorrow and going back out..

it was very fast today and plenty of traction.. id say perfect conditions.. some other things seemed different(maybe a new log pile on the expert) besides that the double black expert w/e you wanna call it didnt sem changed as far as i can remember..

thign that should be changed.. that low cross tree :) and the one shortly following it.. ruin my momentum and i swear i almost hit(have my seat rather high and im a tall guy)

oh ya and a tree fell and was in the way cant remember where btu there was a rock on teh righ side that helped me over it.. besides that that tree sucked..

[gopherhockey]

thign that should be changed.. that low cross tree :) and the one shortly following it.. ruin my momentum and i swear i almost hit(have my seat rather high and im a tall guy)

oh ya and a tree fell and was in the way cant remember where btu there was a rock on teh righ side that helped me over it.. besides that that tree sucked..

The troll tree? We'll never change that one... its a classic. :D (We just need a replacement troll!) There is a tree just following it that has dropped pretty low - one of our group busted his helmet on it. I'm not sure if we need to hurry to remove it though as it kind of adds challenge.

We stopped and cut out that tree you are talking about. It was on the intermediate out trail. One of our first time group riders had a most excellent fold-out saw that did the trick.

[crux]

The troll tree? We'll never change that one... its a classic. :D (We just need a replacement troll!)

Saw some Troll lawn ornaments at Fleet Farm the other day and thought about placing a few randomly thru the trail.

Anyone planning on riding this afternoon?

[robc]

Hey folks, if anyone happened to come across an iPod nano in a gray armband case in the leb lot, it is mine. I think I left it on the trunk when I drove off on tuesday evening. Its probably somewhere on the freeway between there and Brooklyn Park, but maybe I'll get lucky and someone found it.

Thanks!
Rob

[bovaddict]

i know the trees are fine just bug me.. oh well..

good to hear you got rid of that one tree.

i bought some clip ins today and shoes (had a hell of a time on my old shoes/metal platform pedals) so im ready to go back out next nice day.. :)

[crux]

Trail was dry and fast tonight. Touch of rain would not hurt.

[DanB]

There is a tree just following it that has dropped pretty low - one of our group busted his helmet on it. I'm not sure if we need to hurry to remove it though as it kind of adds challenge.


That and Ted's overly large melon is pretty hard. :D

[gopherhockey]

.5" of rain and more on the way... severe weather even. I'd stay off the trail for a bit - especially beacuse of the work we did on Dream yesterday, thats going to be very muddy with he slightest bit of rain.

[Yammer]

Sure, I just finish getting my new bike built and it rains for two days!
So how long is it taking Lebs to dry up these days?

Thanks, Patrick

[gopherhockey]

Leb will probably need 6-12 hours depending on sun, wind etc. 24 hours is a safe bet just about anytime. If its so wet that 24 hours can't dry it up we typically ask Dakota to close the lot. (rare, happens during week long rains etc.)

[gopherhockey]

Dakota County has closed the bike trails until further notice due to recent rains.

[gopherhockey]

Don't forget that Lebanon Hills was closed yesterday by Dakota County due to recent rains.

We expect it to be re-opened either late today or by Saturday. Please stay tuned here for more info.

... just trying to save people a trip out only to find the parking lot and trails closed off.

[bigwheel]

We expect it to be re-opened either late today or by Saturday. Please stay tuned here for more info..

I haven't been to Leb today, but am almost certain that it will be too wet to ride at all today.

At 1:45, Salem was still too wet to ride, and Salem dries faster than Leb.

[gopherhockey]

Dakota County has re-opened the lot. I hear the X and XX are still a bit wet so please use caution out there.

[Yammer]

Has anybody been down there today?
Did the rains hit the area?
Is it ridable?

[gopherhockey]

It hasn't rained today although its certainly looked like it.

I'd bet Leb is ok to ride, just a bit damp in the X and XX loops...

[stoneage]

Went to M-H and then TO. TO is close to Leb and it was just tacky. It should be just fine.

[flutterbyes]

tacky with a few damp spots to watch out for. Also a downed tree in the X loop (did someone already say that? I haven't read every single post)

[Danimal]

Yes, tree down, anyone get out ther with a chainsaw yet? If not lemmie know.

[gopherhockey]

Yes, tree down, anyone get out ther with a chainsaw yet? If not lemmie know.

Please be as exact as possible about its location and I can go take care of it... before Tedman's curve, before the XX entrance...??

[transplant]

It's right after the X entrance, in between the small logpiles. Maybe 2-3 turns in. Ya can't miss it, I'm here to tell ya.

[ryno lite]

Leb could use some nice little mileage marker signs like Murph, just for instances like reporting trees down, etc.!

[gopherhockey]

Leb could use some nice little mileage marker signs like Murph, just for instances like reporting trees down, etc.!

Leb has signs every .2 miles... we thought of it first ;) I think someone pulled up one or two of them and they could use better milage stickers is about it.

I'll try get that log yet today or at the latest tomorrow.

[tedsti]

The log has been moved and the small branches in the XX are cleared. Leb is good to go.

[Danimal]

Thanks Ted.

[ryno lite]

Trail was dry and in perfect condition tonight! Get out and ride! I actually had the place to myself for once. Kind of nice. Deer on the trails and turkeys gobbling in the woods and no other riders. I loved it!

[stoneage]

It was an odd weekend. Saturday, we saw only 3 riders (2 at M-H and 1 at TO), only 3 at Leb yesterday and 1 at Wirth later in the day. 7 total for 2 days. We don't need any more trails.;)

[bigwheel]

Tues 5/29 Noon

Perfect condition. Tacky and Fast. If you can get there before the storm hits, you'll have a good ride.

To those of you who have been moving the fallen trees out of the way and to those of you that pick up Trash/WaterBottles/GooPacks/etc: THANKS! It makes our job much easier.

[gmargolf]

Was out today about noon, suprisingly the majority of the trail was wet. Muddy corners and puddles in low lying area through out the entire trail. Would stay off for a while, and if we get more rain today I would let it dry for a few days...

[jjrsds]

Thinking Leb is to wet for a 6 pm ride today. Post up with conditions if someone gets a chance to check it out, as I won't get a chance to look at before work this morning.

[bigwheel]

Thinking Leb is to wet for a 6 pm ride today. Post up with conditions if someone gets a chance to check it out, as I won't get a chance to look at before work this morning.

We will be there with Dakota County this afternoon, and will post something afterwards.

JJ, look @ http://www.morcmtb.org/forums/showthread.php?t=21308

[gopherhockey]

Just a reminder that the parking lot will be closed to bikers/hikers on Sat. June 2 for the National Trails Day event.

We will also be closing the XX loop.

Conditions permitting, it would be a good day to ride Murphy instead... the less people we have on the trails during the volunteer event the better.

We should be all cleared out of the lot by 2pm Saturday.

[gopherhockey]

Leb is in good shape. Feel free to head out and ride anytime....

[DanB]

Will the Thursday Group Ride be at Lebanon or Murphy?

[gopherhockey]

Will the Thursday Group Ride be at Lebanon or Murphy?

Murphy.. this time only. :p

If we find its wet over there we'll drive to Leb and do it there.

[jjrsds]

Thanks for the update John, have a good ride at Murphy and don't forget the kitty treats.

[destrago]

Just got in from Leb. I didn't come across any mud that you'll sink into and damage the trail, but there's still a lot of slick spots. I didn't go into X/XX because they're usually worse yet. If you ride be careful on the corners, lots of slicks on some of the corners.

-Tony

[gopherhockey]

Just got in from Leb. I didn't come across any mud that you'll sink into and damage the trail, but there's still a lot of slick spots. I didn't go into X/XX because they're usually worse yet. If you ride be careful on the corners, lots of slicks on some of the corners.

-Tony

Hmmm.. this is conflicting. If we can't ride the X/XX at Leb we shouldn't be riding Murphy..

I walked into Leb and it was mostly dry. Riders coming out had no mudd on their bikes.

[destrago]

Hmmm.. this is conflicting. If we can't ride the X/XX at Leb we shouldn't be riding Murphy..

I walked into Leb and it was mostly dry. Riders coming out had no mudd on their bikes.

Leb is mostly dry. Just some slick mud spots around some of the corners. I didn't go into X/XX because I was worried they would be worse yet. I don't think having leb open for riding is going to lead to any appreciable damage. Murphy, being so new, is probably a lot softer right now.

-Tony

[gopherhockey]

One more reminder that tomorrow the Leb lot will be closed to bike and hiker traffic. You can r