New succesful wet trails strategy.

[guest_s]

We get a lot of riders riding Theo when it is wet. A few weeks ago when we were out flagging the trail it had just rained. Within 1/2 hour after the rainfall, we saw people riding the trails.

This threw up a red flag. "It just rained and people are out riding the trails......WTF?!" is what went on in my head. Then I got to thinking, maybe they just simply don't know any better.

So I thought it might be best to don the Bike Patrol gear, put on the diplomacy hat, and hang out at the trailhead right after a rain. This happened yesterday. It rained then the sun came out.....and within 1/2 hour, sure enough, riders started showing up to ride.

This was a huge success! I had one guy with headphones actually get onto the trail and rode it. I met him when he came out and talked to him about the damage it causes. Then as I was riding out, two more riders showed up at the service road gate. I told them the trail was closed due to it being wet and they asked why. I explained and they were totally nice and understanding about it. Then more came, same story, super understanding. It was clear they just didn't know any better, but after I talked to them, they were like "oh, I never really thought about it".

So now that I have done this, I realize that many of the people riding Theo when it is wet just don't know they are causing damage. Hanging out and talking to people was a 100 percent success.

I attached some pictures of what some parts of the trail looked like. If the trails look like this, please do not ride them.

I plan to do this more often. Also, if anyone else is interested in helping out at the trailhead after a rainfall, let me know. We would be happy to set you up with materials that can help educate riders.

[Ish]

We saw the same thing at leb last night but it was only a couple riders. Doing trail work in the middle of the trail aforded us the opportunity to talk with them briefly.

Nice work Shad.

[bigwheel]

Sorry to poach on the theo thread, but we had about 8-10 riders out at Leb last night. This was about a half-hour after it was raining hard and we were sitting in the vehicles waiting for it to let up before heading in for trail work.

I missed this guy, but one of them told John "Dude, you gotta post up! We can't tell if the trail is open or not." FYI, the Trail Conditions were updated at 8am, saying that the trail would not be ridable. Then we got more rain in the morning, and a bunch more around 5pm.

I don't want to have to post a guard at the entrance whenever it rains. Most of the poachers know about MORC and the site. With our constant rants, I can't imagine that anyone doesn't know they should stay off of wet trails. But some people are either stupid or inconsiderate.

Still, I think that Shad's idea is a good one if you can get the volunteers. But IMO, you have to catch them before their ride. Otherwise, it is like answering "Yes, Dear" to a spouse's rant, and doing whatever you want.

[THUMP!]

I think Theo is a bit different than Leb. I would venture to bet lots of folks that ride there don't have a clue about MORC. Many times when I am there I see kids on bmx bikes, old skool 10 speeds...I even saw a woman with a flowery basket. This is a truly urban trail so I think(what do I know) that while there are lots of MORC riders there are lots of regular city folk that use it and don't know better and some, just probably don't care.
I think one BIG sign that says "If trails are wet, don't ride them as it ruins them" would do wonders. It can't be little or one of many signs...it needs to be prominent like below.
http://indiana.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/2007/06/11/vann_trail_sign_3.jpg
I know we can't manage an open/closed sign but it we could...
http://www.imba.com/resources/trail_building/images/jumppark_6.jpg

[guest_s]

Bill, you are spot on. Theo does have many riders who have no idea what MORC or MOCA is.

I think there are a few who know better and ride anyway. But I think the majority just don't know better......especially after my experience last night.

I plan to work on some handouts that have graphics and text explaining why not to ride trails when they are wet. When I get this done, I will post up the handout and we can see if we want to have these for other trails too.

[widespot]

If we can manage to turn personally turn away riders it seems it would stand to reason we could manage a sign. :confused:

I will say the signs out there now say


OPEN
when trails are dry


Maybe if "when trails are dry" were bigger?

Thanks for being out there yesterday Shad. For anyone who frequents this site to claim ignorance is ridiculous.:banghead:

[widespot]

Bill, you are spot on. Theo does have many riders who have no idea what MORC or MOCA is.

I think there are a few who know better and ride anyway. But I think the majority just don't know better......especially after my experience last night.

I plan to work on some handouts that have graphics and text explaining why not to ride trails when they are wet. When I get this done, I will post up the handout and we can see if we want to have these for other trails too.

Let me know if you need any help with the handouts, depending on how many you need I may be able to help out.

[gopherhockey]

I think Theo is a bit different than Leb. I would venture to bet lots of folks that ride there don't have a clue about MORC.

Different, but not by all that much actually. We have our share of people who have no clue about MORC or about riding wet trails. We have our share of ride-ins from around the area... lots of kids, lots of people who do know better but have that entitled thing going on.

All the same its a good strategy to educate in a way that can be positive. Its easy to become real bitter as a trail worker... but I believe we get more results when we are at the trailhead educating vs. out on the trail.

If we had more willing to do this we'd go a long way with this issue. I think we might even get more memberships.

[THUMP!]

Shad,
Why not put one prominent sign up right at the start of the North Loop? If there is one in-your-face and easily understandable sign right there it should do lots of work for you. Standing there only adds the shame and confrontation factors to the equation...plus trying to get down there after every rain and just looking at a trail you can't ride would be frustrating!
P.S. Nice whale

[THUMP!]

Don't make me beat you down Lundell.

[guest_s]

Shad,
Why not put one prominent sign up right at the start of the North Loop?

We have wanted to do this for a long time. But the land manager doesn't want us to have a large prominent sign. We are in the works with some new signage plans, so hopefully we can work out a deal and get some better info up there.

[Slimpee]

As I understand it the MPRB is very particular about what we can and can't put on signs. Signage has to be "positive" ie "Trails OPEN when dry" as opposed to "Trails CLOSED when wet".

Are we allowed to put up signs explaining how riding wet damages the trails?

On the other hand, signage won't help a ton, IMHO, people will just ignore but i've always like the idea of education. That being said, I have to actually get out there and do it...

[Ken Earley]

I think it's not just an issue of not knowing any better. To some extent, I think people think that muddy biking is what off roading is all about.

I know this pic is a bit extreme, but it makes my point. I didn't know to stay off the wet trails until I started reading stuff on the MORC site.

http://www.dennisflood.com/photos/gallery/Blue-Cup-2004/l-dirty_muddy_bike.jpg

[silence]

we ride our private trails in the rain all the time- they definitely have developed some mudholes and the like

[BrightYellow]

I think it's not just an issue of not knowing any better. To some extent, I think people think that muddy biking is what off roading is all about.

I know this pic is a bit extreme, but it makes my point. I didn't know to stay off the wet trails until I started reading stuff on the MORC site.

Wow! Looks like you took the trail home with you!

[Ken Earley]

Wow! Looks like you took the trail home with you!

That's not me. Just found it on the internet to make my point. :)

[guest_s]

I guess I look at it this way. There is no way we can stop every rider......no matter how hard we try. But by getting out there, even if it's only sometimes, we spread the word in a positive way. By me being on Patrol (we do have an agreement with the MPRB) people are willing to listen and take us a bit more seriously. This could also be a duty for our new "Trail Ambassador's" if we choose to go that route, which I think we will. mara and I already appointed Justin as one and he doesn't even know it yet.....:D

[Slimpee]

This could also be a duty for our new "Trail Ambassador's" if we choose to go that route, which I think we will. mara and I already appointed Justin as one and he doesn't even know it yet.....:D

If by "Trail Ambassador" you mean "Trail Enforcer (armed w/ Pulaski)" I'm in...

[singletrackmind]

If by "Trail Ambassador" you mean "Trail Enforcer (armed w/ Pulaski)" I'm in...

Sounds like a pain to carry around. Theo has lots of sticks laying about. What's wrong with just jabbing them in peoples spokes as they ride by? It would be like an endo seminar, except nobody's aware they're attending.