Acknowledge Expert and pro/semi pro seperate

[redpic]

I know the MNSCS is not as large as the WORS series but It would be nice if the MNSeries could follow in the WORS Footsteps on this one.

From the WORS Site:

New and combined WORS classes from 2007 to recognize both USA Cycling Expert racers separate from Pro & Semi-Pro competitors.

Experts may compete for Elite/Expert overall. Elites are excluded from Expert age class overalls.

Im not sure how this could be done but maybe we could come up with some ideas.

Give the Comp guys a reason to continue moving up. At this point the semi pros/pros win and there is no recognition for the TRUE expert riders.

[Charlytri]

As an expert racer who would stand to gain from that change, I would NOT be for it. There are simply not enough racers to warrant the separate categories.

*Start Rant*

Don't take this personally, but I get annoyed that any comp guys need a "reason" to move up. If you are racing for the top spots in the comp, sport, or citizen races then you have a reason to move up. I would say stop being a sand bagger and race up a class. What, you may not win something anymore? This isn't the 2nd grade science fair where everyone gets a ribbon. Race for the fun of it, race for the challenge, race to improve, or race for yourself. Don't race so that you can feel good about your name being called out at the awards. I might as well drop down to sport if I wanted that.

For the record, back when I originally started to race expert there was no comp class. You made an even bigger jump to move up to expert and people were more proud to say they raced that expert than to say that they were a top finisher in sport.

I can't pull it up now on the site, but I remember seeing a lot of the same names in the top spots in the comp class from '06 to '07. I have no sympathy for those people and their struggle for a reason to move up.

[Tower]

In my opinion as a so called "expert" racer, if you call yourself a pro or semi-pro you should have your own class...

On the flipside, using the same start time as Jeff Hall and Doug Swanson is a good motivator to not get lapped...

Podium shots seem to be good race directing PR... Amatuers should be recognized separate from those considered to be pro's...

[Jamone]

Would this then eliminate the possibility of a payout for those exeperts who actually have better times than a Pro/semi-pro. That would be unfourtunate. I guess I don't know everybody's status, but aren't there only like 3-5 pro/semi-pro's that show up?

[dirtgrl]

That would be a "nice to have".

A number of years back, Kyia, Jenna and I were the only expert women for a chunk of the season. No surprise, that year was a BORING one, and I dropped back to Sport the next year.

Would winning as the only expert woman have motivated me any more that year? Maybe not, but it couldn't have hurt.

It would be a little more fair in some of the post-race reporting. It's awkward to hear that "Sarah kills the field by 25 minutes" when I don't even consider Sarah my competitor. Not terribly enticing to new racers in a category that's desperately lacking in competitors.

[nutty]

If you move up to semi pro, then to pro, you are moving up. Still you race the same group of riders so what do you move up for? I say give them there own group/race and pay out is on the # that show up, if you dont like it go race with jeff hall all over the place and get pro points. Let expert riders race expert riders, im going to race expert this year, im moving up to race expert riders not to race comp riders again .If you are good move up , what ever class you are in you should be happy if its 2 riders or 200 but race YOUR class.

[wildride]

I would like to see the semi pro and pros race there own class. let them duke it out and let the experts race there own race. You always see the same top guys in expert. Just like any other class when you hit the top you move up or if you just like to suffer. I just think that if your going to go pro then you should be racing pro racers.:nono: :D

[I_Fall_Alot]

http://www.lrb.usace.army.mil/WhoWeAre/EM/2men.gif

[Matthew]

I come from a running background so maybe my view point is different, but how many 5k's, track races, or marathons have people run where they've shown up and there have been different classes to register for? None. If your there to race you race everyone. Sure you probably don't have a chance at the trophy's or money, but is a podium shot really the only reason your doing it. Most the people that show up in the expert class at the mnscs show are the same every single race year in and year out, so regardless of what license thier holding nothing really changes about them that much. This year I know Eric O and Brendan Moore both moved up one level from expert to semi pro and from semi pro to pro. Has anything but the card their carrying really changed? Becuase they hold that license are they suddenly training 10 more hours a week? Nope, they are the same two people I have been racing in that class for years. They have families, jobs, school. Same stuff I do. My point is that mountain biking really is one of the only endurance sports that offers classes. Running, nordic skiing, even swimming don't do that sort of thing. Also if you made the people who won the expert class keep moving up to semi pro and pro you would eventually have everyone in the pro class. Becuase if you won you would have to move up, then the guy you barely beat would win the next one and he would move up... so on and so forth. It's a race, show up and race who's on the line, if you happen to beat a few of the pro's or semi pro's then I guess that makes it that much better. Sorry to ramble on.

[dirtgrl]

Also if you made the people who won the expert class keep moving up to semi pro and pro you would eventually have everyone in the pro class.

This isn't correct. As a mid-pack expert 40-year old woman who's been racing 12 years, I will never qualify to move up to semi-pro.

The benefit of recognizing expert racers is to celebrate the accomplishments of local riders who don't strive to win money or gain national recognition for our participation in the sport. The pros in my category (Kyia, Jenna and Sarah) I imagine don't limit their objectives to winning the MNSCS series, they also travel and seek competition nationally. Semi-pro/pro is a high caliber of fitness and commitment that only a minority of riders are able to achieve.

[Matthew]

This isn't correct. As a mid-pack expert 40-year old woman who's been racing 12 years, I will never qualify to move up to semi-pro.


Right but if we had them move up or race seperately so that you could win the expert class everytime wouldn't you eventually have to move up or face being called a sandbagger.

Also I noticed you only finished a few races last year, whereas if you had finished 7 races you would have been third overall in the series at the end of the season. Pretty good for a 40 year old mid packer.

[dirtgrl]

Pretty good for a 40 year old mid packer.

You're too kind!

I believe you need to apply with NORBA to get Semi-Pro or Pro status. If I did qualify simply because of my results in the MNSCS (not sure how qualification works), I would anticipate a purely miserable race if I did go on the road. "Back in the day" when on Colorado vacations, I tried 2 NORBA national races and was not a mid-pack expert nationwide.

[redpic]

The previous posts have good points. But the Bottom line is.. Pros and Semi Pros are already in a different class, PERIOD. They are pros and semi pros not experts. MNSCS does not recognize this due to the small field. The payouts and everything else could be left the same. The Expert Racers should be recognized for their successes seperately.

If they arent, then the women who start the same time as the men should not be recognized, the single speeders who start the same time as the non SS bikers should not be recognized. Heck, why have citizen and sport, lets just have a mass start with hundreds of riders and the top 3 overall can get their medals and leave it at that.

What I am saying, is that The expert racers get shadowed by the pros and semi pros. In any other class these guys would get **** from everyone else for not moving up. I think the guys racing at pro/semipro level are all great, I mean no disrespect to Brendan, Sam, Paul or any of the other guys at their level. They are damn good and all great guys, this is not a hit at them.

Just because the Pros do not have another class to move to, the experts shouldnt be forced to give up their chance at a podium or the joy of winning a race. Cause lets face it, everyone loves having a chance at the podium, thats why we are RACING and not just out there doing group rides.

[natehakensak]

I will concur with Tri and Kurke.
In my opinion...
The reasons for moving up in the MNSCS classes are to each THEIR own.
I moved up from sport to comp to expert with a year in each to get better; race against better competition. I've never won anything, probably never will. I don't do this racing thing to win medals or admiration from others. I still want to get faster and ride against the best MN has to offer, if that means getting my butt kicked by the same riders in a season, then so be it. More fuel for the off-season fire.
Those who stay in sport may have their reasons: work, kids, jobs, etc. Maybe they like the more tame course, are not comfortable with getting passed, or like to race in the cooler part of the day.
If any separation is necessary because of all the talk, separate the womens field, they have the bigger jump to make. Additionally, get rid of the comp class, what is another lap anyway? 25-35 min, that is how much.
WORS probably has to do something since their size is shrinking not... Ride a race over there and have fun on the doubletrack. Fin.

ps: Should we petition to separate Chequammy, Ore2Shore, Iceperson, etc.?

[beccahakensak]

"If any separation is necessary because of all the talk, separate the womens' field, they have the bigger jump to make." -Nate Hackensack

:crazy2:Hold on there Natey (my sincerely not-sexist husband who sounds like he might be in his post...). What's good for the goose is good for the gander. Treat me (as an expert rider this season) just like you want to be treated.

Frankly, I'm excited to move up to expert this season to chase the pro women (my self-esteem is not threatened by their superior results) and battle it out with the other working women! :banana:

My Dad's Advice: Growing up I played a crazy amount of conventional team sports coached primarily by my Dad. Whenever I started to get an inflated ego he would remind me that no matter how many honors or trophys I won there would always be someone who was faster, stronger, quicker, etc. than me, so I had better come up with a better reason to compete than being #1 and getting a prize. I grew up to agree with him and I race for the love of it.

"A gold medal is a nice thing - but if you're not enough without it, you'll never be enough with it." -Irv in Cool Runnings

However, if giving away gold medals means more women will race I say go for it! But as Matt mentioned running races are loaded with entrants who don't get prizes or podium time. So are nordic skiing-triathalon-canoe-etc. races...

[SKullman]

First off, I'm is the same opinion as Mr. Tri.

That being said, I think there is a bit of management that is missing in the MTB crowd. Coming from a Road Racing background (19 years, uhg!) the structure of the USCF now USACycling (USAC) is very easy to understand. In theory this same structure exists in MTB racing but it not enforced until you hit the expert level, hence the need for a race resume to the USAC official when moving to Semi Pro.

I'll try to keep it simple, Cat 5 = Beginner, Cat 4 = Sport, Cat 3 = Comp, Cat 2 = Expert, Cat 1 = Semi Pro

This is how you change categories on the road.

Cat 5-4: Experience in 10 mass start races.Cat 4-3: 20 points in any 12-month period; or experience in 25 qualifying races with a minimum of 10 top ten finishes, or 20 pack finishes with fields over 50. 30 points in 12 months is an automatic upgrade
Cat 3-2: 25 points in any 12-month period
60 points in 12 months is an automatic upgrade
Car 2-1: 30 points in any 12-month period
60 points in 12 months is an automatic upgrade

I'm not saying that this is what should be done for MTB in MN, but the enforcement of categories would certainly stimulate some riders and keep things more interesting. Don't worry, moving backwards is also possible, I have many friends that have down graded from Cat 2 to Cat 3. It's just a letter of request to the official, but if you start winning again in that low category, they will force you up again!

[woodchuck]

First off, I'm is the same opinion as Mr. Tri.

That being said, I think there is a bit of management that is missing in the MTB crowd. Coming from a Road Racing background (19 years, uhg!) the structure of the USCF now USACycling (USAC) is very easy to understand. In theory this same structure exists in MTB racing but it not enforced until you hit the expert level, hence the need for a race resume to the USAC official when moving to Semi Pro.

I'll try to keep it simple, Cat 5 = Beginner, Cat 4 = Sport, Cat 3 = Comp, Cat 2 = Expert, Cat 1 = Semi Pro

This is how you change categories on the road.

Cat 5-4: Experience in 10 mass start races.Cat 4-3: 20 points in any 12-month period; or experience in 25 qualifying races with a minimum of 10 top ten finishes, or 20 pack finishes with fields over 50. 30 points in 12 months is an automatic upgrade
Cat 3-2: 25 points in any 12-month period
60 points in 12 months is an automatic upgrade
Car 2-1: 30 points in any 12-month period
60 points in 12 months is an automatic upgrade

I'm not saying that this is what should be done for MTB in MN, but the enforcement of categories would certainly stimulate some riders and keep things more interesting. Don't worry, moving backwards is also possible, I have many friends that have down graded from Cat 2 to Cat 3. It's just a letter of request to the official, but if you start winning again in that low category, they will force you up again!

But according to the USAcycling.org web site (see link: http://www.usacycling.org/results/results_rankings_guide.pdf) the relation seems to be as follows:

Cat 1 - Pro
Cat 2 - Semi-Pro
Cat 3 - Expert
Cat 4 - Sport
Cat 5 - Beginner (citizen I assume).

This would imply that comp shouldn't exist in your scenario. If this scenario was followed, what would be the best arrangement for MNSCS classes?

I have noticed in another race series I looked at, the expert is more like Comp (i.e. in terms of race lengths etc.) and they have a elite category (assume this is for the pros) that is more like MNSCS expert. Just some observations.

Scott

[RedSquirrel]

Who cares about actual Cat facts. Simple, let me race “with” fastest MTB’ers please!

3 yrs ago I raced sport, it was all about podium (my 1st year mnscs racing).

2 yrs ago Comp class spoiled me, in hindsight I wish it wasn't there. A waste.

Expert class last year was an eye opener. I never scored podium at individual races yet I felt way way more accomplished than podium years.

Just go enjoy MNSCS for what it is and what you ain't. Race expert, start with the fastest guys. You won’t have to multiply and divide to guesstimate how relatively fast you are, get real. Get motivated for the right reasons.

I know Dana ya meant well however tell new expert prospects; in Minnesota you get more than you bargain for in expert class. What a deal, I like it!! Seriously you get to start off with the so called faster guys. Please, put that carrot right beside me and make me suffer! This year for sure, ha ha ha.

Becca I do like the saying, I’m one of those fools who will always chase for the GOLD (however it’s my personal definition of gold that matters).

All, don't ask the race directors add more numbers. 2+2 is hard enough sometimes but 1+1=3. With the numbers the way they are, keep the MNSCS quality the way it is and let’s not burn out the directors.

AND I'll say it again, get rid of comp class.

Later, gotta go stretch and kick. Stretch and kick !!!

[SKullman]

Point taken Heath, Scott I was trying to equate what we had with road stuffs.

It does eventually come down to just riding your bike.

I've raced expert level since 1995, I dropped back to Comp for a season when my first kid was born, that was nice for that mental boost of finishing at the top...but really if I had to stay in expert, nothing mentally would be different.

The cat comparison was mostly a way to find a solution to flush out the sandbaggers, in the road scene sandbaggers are easy to spot and the officials do make an effort to move them up. Here at the MNSCS, there is no effort, unless you count Buck Hill, I like their attitude, group ridicule :)

[ibismojo2001]

Here at the MNSCS, there is no effort, unless you count Buck Hill, I like their attitude, group ridicule :)

Indeed, but the group ridicule was not taken seriously enough for some.

[spooky612]

I am all about more age and class break down in our series. WORS is regarded highly for that reason and many others. Why would we resist learning and emulating the practices of one of the best.

I will be going up to expert and i think we do need more skill separation. While i think i will do ok in that class i dont place myself in the same category as jeff hall and others. i think thats pretty reasonable to assume.

If that is, than i have no business or desire to compete against someone of that level. all very simple. If you wanted the challenge than you should request an upgrade in such a system not come out every week and see yourself buried.

I think every sport thrives and grows as you make sure you have a reasonable amount of skill parity in its divisions.

Our series needs this.

[nutty]

I am all about more age and class break down in our series. WORS is regarded highly for that reason and many others. Why would we resist learning and emulating the practices of one of the best.

I will be going up to expert and i think we do need more skill separation. While i think i will do ok in that class i dont place myself in the same category as jeff hall and others. i think thats pretty reasonable to assume.

If that is, than i have no business or desire to compete against someone of that level. all very simple. If you wanted the challenge than you should request an upgrade in such a system not come out every week and see yourself buried.

I think every sport thrives and grows as you make sure you have a reasonable amount of skill parity in its divisions.

Our series needs this.
:D nice

[Bjmoore1]

Maybe the solution is to follow USA cycling and eliminate the comp division. We could rename it "Expert" and rename the top class "Elite" or "Open". However, I would imagine that most current experts (like Heath, Kurke, Tri, etc) would move up to Open/Elite as quickly as possible for the challenge. <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p></o:p>
I don't think that adding a 5th race category would buy us anything other than smaller fields.<o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>
We should wait a year and see how it works over at WORS. They don't really have too many more Pros/ Semi Pros than we do. If they race separately, it will be a pretty small (<10 person) race.

Cheers from Singapore!
<o:p></o:p>

[woodchuck]

Maybe the solution is to follow USA cycling and eliminate the comp division. We could rename it "Expert" and rename the top class "Elite" or "Open". However, I would imagine that most current experts (like Heath, Kurke, Tri, etc) would move up to Open/Elite as quickly as possible for the challenge. <o>:p></o>:p>
I don't think that adding a 5th race category would buy us anything other than smaller fields.<o>:p></o>:p>
<o>:p></o>:p>
We should wait a year and see how it works over at WORS. They don't really have too many more Pros/ Semi Pros than we do. If they race separately, it will be a pretty small (<10 person) race.

Cheers from Singapore!
<o>:p></o>:p>


Perhaps following the USA Cycling categories might attract some high level riders from outside the MN/WI/IA area. Perhaps not. I like that Maplelag is on the AMBC this year. I think that helps give some exposure for MNSCS.

[spooky612]

Yes i like the rebuttal suggesting no classes of any kind if you are against further break down of the series. It seems we have a few people flying in the face or reason to support their own points.

simple facts.

bicycle racing has separate skill categories. It is set up this way to try to have a somewhat organized skill separation.

I cant really make this any simpler. If there is a distinct difference in skill level between semi pro/pro and expert rider, than you need a separate racing category.

they should be

citizen
sport
comp
expert
semi pro/pro

ss - comp
ss - expert

call it what you will on ss but have two classes.

Race the ss in whichever std field you think makes sense, but make a separation.

Having a few people in a category now is not what will be in the future. if the sport is to thrive and grow you will have more people in smaller categories. Simply aging can make some categories sparse.

Again if you want the challenge petition for a higher category in the case of an expert rider who loves going against a professional racer. If Norba thinks you can handle it upgrade is awarded, and than go get em tiger!

If you wanna talk sandbagging what are these semi pro folk doing? Not knocken them its the only category for them to race in so far. Again i am not saying they are sandbagging but the system is creating this situation not them.

i hope all this rant is falling upon the ears of this new group running the series show now. or what a wasted effort this all is...

[Matthew]

I think there are good points being brought up for both sides of the argument and I don't know that I am for or against either one. There are good reasons to get rid of the comp class. The big one is that the comp class isn't recognized by usacycling so if you hold a license and race comp your points will go in the sport category for usa cycling. Not really fair to the real sport class racers out there. But the comp class is nice for the above average weekend worriors and the roadie cross overs that only race the mtb a few times. I don't know, what I do know is that there is no board of directors or large group of people coordinating the series. There are a couple of guys and then the individual race directors. Basically no one is making any money coordinating the mnscs, it is a volunteer thing and anyone who thinks that we need to make definate changes, I gladly invite you to put your money where your mouth is and volunteer to coordinate or help coordinate the mnscs series.

[redpic]

I think there are good points being brought up for both sides of the argument and I don't know that I am for or against either one. There are good reasons to get rid of the comp class. The big one is that the comp class isn't recognized by usacycling so if you hold a license and race comp your points will go in the sport category for usa cycling. Not really fair to the real sport class racers out there. But the comp class is nice for the above average weekend worriors and the roadie cross overs that only race the mtb a few times. I don't know, what I do know is that there is no board of directors or large group of people coordinating the series. There are a couple of guys and then the individual race directors. Basically no one is making any money coordinating the mnscs, it is a volunteer thing and anyone who thinks that we need to make definate changes, I gladly invite you to put your money where your mouth is and volunteer to coordinate or help coordinate the mnscs series.

I know myself and a few others have volunteered to be part of the MNSCS Board of Directors that at last update, is still in the works.

I think everyone would be amazed at the number of people who would be willing to help coordinate if we only knew who to go to.

Maybe those few people who currently run the event could start a volunteer thread here or a place on the MNSCS site for volunteers to join and accept tasks. I have been involved in this sport for 3 years now and I still dont know who these "few" people are.

The people running the series really do a great job without getting any credit for how hard they work. Everyone of us appreciates what they do, even if it does not always seem like it.

But I also believe that there being a few volunteers running an event is not a good excuse to forgo making something better when possible.

[redpic]

Yes i like the rebuttal suggesting no classes of any kind if you are against further break down of the series. It seems we have a few people flying in the face or reason to support their own points.

simple facts.

bicycle racing has separate skill categories. It is set up this way to try to have a somewhat organized skill separation.

I cant really make this any simpler. If there is a distinct difference in skill level between semi pro/pro and expert rider, than you need a separate racing category.

they should be

citizen
sport
comp
expert
semi pro/pro

ss - comp
ss - expert

call it what you will on ss but have two classes.

Race the ss in whichever std field you think makes sense, but make a separation.

Having a few people in a category now is not what will be in the future. if the sport is to thrive and grow you will have more people in smaller categories. Simply aging can make some categories sparse.

Again if you want the challenge petition for a higher category in the case of an expert rider who loves going against a professional racer. If Norba thinks you can handle it upgrade is awarded, and than go get em tiger!

If you wanna talk sandbagging what are these semi pro folk doing? Not knocken them its the only category for them to race in so far. Again i am not saying they are sandbagging but the system is creating this situation not them.

i hope all this rant is falling upon the ears of this new group running the series show now. or what a wasted effort this all is...


Nicely said

[redpic]

Maybe the solution is to follow USA cycling and eliminate the comp division. We could rename it "Expert" and rename the top class "Elite" or "Open". However, I would imagine that most current experts (like Heath, Kurke, Tri, etc) would move up to Open/Elite as quickly as possible for the challenge. <O:p></O:p>
I don't think that adding a 5th race category would buy us anything other than smaller fields.<O:p></O:p>
<O:p></O:p>
We should wait a year and see how it works over at WORS. They don't really have too many more Pros/ Semi Pros than we do. If they race separately, it will be a pretty small (<10 person) race.

Cheers from Singapore!
<O:p></O:p>


definately a good idea to see how it Works out for WORS, especially to see what changes/if any take place.

In the concept above would the new "Expert" class race 5 laps or the traditional "comp" 4 laps, is it essentially just renaming the classes? Following the USA Cycling guidelines does seems logical.

[FarmerBEN]

as a currently non-racer, I would have to say if you're going to add class why not find a way to move in a different direction rather than adding more of the same. An example I would give would be me deciding not to race in Red Wing.

I am not particularly hardcore, but I can handle fairly technical stuff with little or no trouble. So I didn't really want to do citizen because the course didn't really excite me (no southern cross or quarry), sport is always a mess because of too many racers who seem to take things too seriously.(and still no stairway). so by now we are up to comp, which has racers who take things even more seriously (which is fine, I just don't want to hinder them, and get in the way) and not to mention the fact that now we are up to 4 laps. I say I wanted to do stairway, not that I wanted to do it 4 times. As an average weekend warrior that is a little more than I am currently conditioned for. Maybe I am way off base, and nobody compete in a race that's 2 laps of the expert course, but I am willing to bet you could probably get just as many as another higher class.

[spooky612]

I thought this season there was going to be a board who would take over running the whole shebang, with erics as the main sponsor? at least thats what i remember from the awards.

[woodchuck]

This thread got me a bit interested so I did a rough search of other state series and it a appears that about half follow USA cycling categories and the other half have their own definitions (e.g. define their own categories like WORS and MNSCS do but not necessarily that same as WORS or MNSCS). The one thing that becomes evident in a quick search like I did is that many of the state series are not as coordinated as MNSCS and WORS are (i.e. many other state web sites are a bit haphazard and the races seem to each have their own flavor (no standardization)). There sure are a lot of great races out there though.

Perhaps the MNSCS could do some polling next offseason on the MORC forums to see if people want to change things or not and if change is necessary, what kind. The other option is to provide a feedback form to racers on if they want change (or if there are any other comments to improve the series).

[motomofo]

As one of the so called sandbaggers, I still Love Comp class. I had some great races and met some great guys last year. When I would finish a race, there was nothing left. I could not have gone another lap. Nor would I have wanted to. I enjoy 1 less lap. Not getting blown out of the water every race. And yes, sometimes it's fun to collect some schwag. That doesn't make me a sandbagger. It makes me one more wheel in the cog of the MNSCS. Also known as a paying customer. I would like to say thank you to the organization. Because with out ya, we would be spinning circles in chaos. What it comes down to is racing in the class your comfortable with. The top pro or semi pro guys should not be penalized for trying to do better. If you don't like expert come on down to Comp. Maybe we should have one huge comp class that does 4 laps. LOL

[DaveH]

I agree with Cold-bear! I like Comp. The competition is strong, and (you DONT NEED A LICENSE to race), and you get to see the Expert finish! I also like the combined races with all classes together (Cable Off-Road Classic, Ore-to-Shore, Chequamegon.)

See you all out at Hillside on Sunday! ($10 to ride clean white single-track)

[spooky612]

So im still looken for a reply on this question. My understanding is there is a group or board overseeing the whole race series now. If so im curious if any of them have read this thread and if we can get some action vs words if possable.
If not i know id like to contact them. This discussion brought up lots of good points and an odvious need to do something.

[beccahakensak]

So im still looken for a reply on this question. My understanding is there is a group or board overseeing the whole race series now. If so im curious if any of them have read this thread and if we can get some action vs words if possable.
If not i know id like to contact them. This discussion brought up lots of good points and an odvious need to do something.
Sean, I think Matthew addressed your question on 2/28...

[RichZilla]

...and you get to see the Expert finish!

I race in the Comp class and I agree, it is cool to see the Expert finish... usually right after they lap me.

I am also one of the riders who would be unable to complete another lap for the Expert class. I could BARELY finish most of the Comp races. I was in total survival mode.

[redpic]

So im still looken for a reply on this question. My understanding is there is a group or board overseeing the whole race series now. If so im curious if any of them have read this thread and if we can get some action vs words if possable.
If not i know id like to contact them. This discussion brought up lots of good points and an odvious need to do something.

Sean- I followed up around Christmas as to the status of the Board of Directors. They were working on getting the articles of incorporation together. I do not know this for sure, but I don't think the board will have much say in this years series.

[spooky612]

thanks dana ok it looks like we will all have to have a town hall meeting at the end of this season :)