MTB Trails and Duluth Parks

[toasthaiku]

The Duluth Parks & Rec Commission's set it's annual priorities this week. Mountain bike trails made our top 10 priorities.

This won't go far unless interested persons get involved. How? Glad you asked.

Easiest is letting us know you think mountain biking is important and why. Email director Carl Seehus or the commissioners.
http://www.ci.duluth.mn.us/city/parksandrecreation/Secondarypages/parkcommission.pdf
Or speak up during the Public Comment portion of a P&R meeting. Meetings are the 2nd Wednesday of the month, 4:30 - 6 at the P&R dept, intersection of Lake Ave. and 4th St.

Best is getting involved and offering a solution. Groups with ideas, people and the willingness to raise funds succeed. That's how the dog park got built and why there will be a disc golf course this summer. It's one thing to say "Gee whiz, mountain bike trails are swell." It's another to say "We're willing to GPS and maintain a section."

If your group or buddies are interested, now's the time to put something together.

[Buck]

Nick,
Have you heard anything from Brad or Andy?

thanks!
Buck

[toasthaiku]

Nope. What's up?

[TrailSquirell]

sad news buck, the trails at spirit... well... lets say that the hikers kind of demolished them... theres nothin left of anything anymore! We have trails on private property now but those locations will be hidden and hidden well.

[Buck]

sad news buck, the trails at spirit... well... lets say that the hikers kind of demolished them... theres nothin left of anything anymore! We have trails on private property now but those locations will be hidden and hidden well.

You guys(FR/DH) need to start working together as a group, I know you can get some legit public jump trails up there, just need to go through the proper channels, now is your chance. don't take the easy way out!!! Get in touch with the City they are asking for people like you to show up!

Not really surprising news to me, I told you ya when ya first built them they would get torn down. That's how illegal trails go.

bummer regardless.

weRd.
Buck

[mtnbykr]

sad news buck, the trails at spirit... well... lets say that the hikers kind of demolished them... theres nothin left of anything anymore! We have trails on private property now but those locations will be hidden and hidden well.

don't blame it on the hikers. in another thread [http://www.morcmtb.org/forums/showthread.php?t=20468 (http://www.morcmtb.org/forums/showthread.php?t=20468)] i told you if you didn't work on making these legal, the CITY would remove them. the city saw your illegal trails as a liability and a maintainence issue.

also i don't think the the city cares if you build trails on private property, as long as you have permission from the landowner. but by talking about those trails on here, you could be setting yourself and the landowner up for some legal action if anyone was to get seriously hurt on those trails.

why is the freeride group so stuck on illegal trails?? do you really think this helps out your cause??

[mountaincyclerulz]

Can we approch the city if were not part of a "bike club"? I know we need one but I don't think I'm ready to start something like that. Maybe it's easier than I think but I need some insight on that one. I can personally show up for meetings and make a statement seeing as I participated in a weekend of IMBA trail building school at steeplechase building safe sustainable trials I would like to put those skills to good use for us all. I just don't know if I alone can convince the department that it's the right thing to do. Some advice would be helpful. BTW when is the next meeting I can go to?

[toasthaiku]

Can we approch the city if were not part of a "bike club"? I know we need one but I don't think I'm ready to start something like that. Maybe it's easier than I think but I need some insight on that one. I can personally show up for meetings and make a statement seeing as I participated in a weekend of IMBA trail building school at steeplechase building safe sustainable trials I would like to put those skills to good use for us all. I just don't know if I alone can convince the department that it's the right thing to do. Some advice would be helpful. BTW when is the next meeting I can go to?

You don't have to be a member of anything. One guy stating his opinions and another audience member voting was all it took to get MTB trails on the list.

Right now it's just a window of opportunity. The Parks commission recognizes MTB trails as something important and would probably support something related to that cause.

It's probably best if a group of like-minded people get together. Hopefully other riders will post up. I emailed COGGS with the same info. Pick a project or idea and go with it. It doesn't have to be huge. A small accomplishment beats a grand plan that goes nowhere.

Don't worry about going it alone. Showing up and stating for :30 secs why MTB access to trails helps. Meetings are 4:30-6, 2nd Wed of each month, at the Parks & Rec dept meeting room. It's at the intersection of Lake Ave. & 4th St.

[ryno lite]

Sounds like a few area residents are interested and I know other Duluth residents who would be interested, maybe it's time for a group to get together and start a MORC chapter. I think the start of a local trail club would go a long way. Biking clubs are fine, but I think a MORC chapter dedicated to gaining, building, and maintaining trails would be great for the Duluth area! A MORC chapter would give you the strength of a statewide organization and the strength of IMBA backing you up. Don't want to step on any toes up there, I just think it would be a great time and it's starting to look like the right time to do it. Get organized and get your trails while the city has an open ear!

[Buck]

Can we approch the city if were not part of a "bike club"? I know we need one but I don't think I'm ready to start something like that. Maybe it's easier than I think but I need some insight on that one. I can personally show up for meetings and make a statement seeing as I participated in a weekend of IMBA trail building school at steeplechase building safe sustainable trials I would like to put those skills to good use for us all. I just don't know if I alone can convince the department that it's the right thing to do. Some advice would be helpful. BTW when is the next meeting I can go to?

Yeah Kurt is supposed to coach ya through the process as an IMBA rep! Get in touch with him, its his J-O-B!

If nothing else start showing up at all the meetings, the more riders that show up the better whether you are connected with a group or not! The more the better, there has to be like 12-15 FR/DH?trials guys up in D-town!

weRd.
buck

[TrailPatrol]

Sounds like a few area residents are interested and I know other Duluth residents who would be interested, maybe it's time for a group to get together and start a MORC chapter. I think the start of a local trail club would go a long way. Biking clubs are fine, but I think a MORC chapter dedicated to gaining, building, and maintaining trails would be great for the Duluth area! A MORC chapter would give you the strength of a statewide organization and the strength of IMBA backing you up. Don't want to step on any toes up there, I just think it would be a great time and it's starting to look like the right time to do it. Get organized and get your trails while the city has an open ear!

Isn't COGGS still an affiliate member of MORC?

Hans

[ryno lite]

Isn't COGGS still an affiliate member of MORC?

Hans

Don't know for sure. Seems like one way or another they could use a more organized mountain bike front in Duluth.

[TrailSquirell]

But with ilegal trails, you can push the limit, go bigger and higher, and not have to worry about insurance or anything, it's a cover your own rear type of a deal. You don't have to "dumb it down" for the average rider, and if it's kept a seceret, like the ones we have now will be, you can stay big and go even bigger when you want to. With legal trails... it's just to much of a hastle to make everything absalutely ligit and idiot proof so that the average joe could jump your biggest jump and land just fine. Were's the excitement in the jumps if you know you can short it and be fine?

[bigwheel]

If you decide to go the legal route, you will have a much better chance of being taken seriously if you have an organization and a go-to spokesperson (preferably only one) that they know they can talk to. They might be polite to a couple individuals that speak up at a meeting, but I doubt they will take any action on your requests.

If you decide to go the illegal route, have fun, but realize that your trail could go away at any time, and other bad things could happen.

[TrailSquirell]

I'm not trying to pull a once sider, yes i would like to have legalized trails. I'm just not ready to put forth the effort with all the legalization and leading groups with others and whatnot. I'm still only 18... sad but true.


But the illegal trails will always exsist, nomader how many we'd have to build.

[nord0306]

But with ilegal [stuff], you can push the limit, go bigger and higher, and not have to worry about insurance or anything

sounds like a good way to end up in jail

[Buck]

the dumbing down thing. That is in fact not true in alot of cases. I've been lucky enough to ride at a number of FR areas that build for the expert rider and have ride arounds as an option for novice rider, nothing that would take away from the fun/challenge/rush of it. (check out Black Rock Freeride (http://brmba.org/), whistler/blackcomb, Keystone, Silverton, New York City just completed their first public DJ park)

Its all up to the people leading the pack. If your the guy out designing and building the trail you'll get to decide the level of the trail.

As for Duluth, Spirit Mtn is a gold mine...waiting to be tapped into!

I'm going to try to attend the city council meeting.

weRd.
Buck

[LOKI]

Hey guys,
Frequent site visitor, infrequent poster. So I see alot of people speaking to small sections or areas of trails but I have never heard people speak the idea of a bigger broader system. We have potential trails in Lester, we have potential trails at Hartley we have potential trails at Spirit. We wonder why the SHT has been so hotly contested and I feel it is because that is a trail that LINKS all the systems together. IF we had a way to link all the trails, plus could protect the individual trails themselves we would have the most extensive EPIC system in the Midwest, even better than Medora. I have always hoped that Kurt and IMBA would look seriously at that challenge. In any case realize how big the Duluth Park system really is. I live in Carlton, but I ride in the city of Duluth and that is Fond Du Lac, Mission Creek etc. The terrain there is endless, steep, smooth and is really the western boundary to a system that could start at Lester as the eastern boundary. We need to create an environment of trails that people plan their trips around and their vactations around. Take a look at Marquette, take a look at the Kingdom Trails in VT, take a look at Pisgah in Asheville, NC. We need leadership both in the local clubs and in IMBA to help us create an overall big vision big idea, set those goals and then work towards them.
Kurt do you have monthly meetings with your visions and ideas that we could come and listem to? Does that happen at COGGS or other affiliated meetings? If not, could we come together with COGGS and with other fragmented groups and establish a bigger plan that could then later be presented to the city as way that they could increase tourism and quality of life? On top of that I have seen that IMBA can also work to establish potetnial economic growth potential because of bigger trails systems. Imagine the hotels, bars and bike shops that we could link together through a trail like that? Look at the already established assets we have, IE the park system itself, the Munger trail, Jay Cooke State Park.......endless.

[TrailSquirell]

As far as i remember, COGGS had meeting on tuesday nights at 6:30, every tuesday there were rides, i do believe, and maybe twice a month there were meetings. Easyest way to get ahold of the COGGS boys would be by phone, or show up at a few rides.

[rudy]

Superior Biking Trail. Lets just get a can of red paint and claim whatever trails we want as ours.

Seriously though, Loki has nailed it. I would like to do something to help promote what we have up here. I propose we get a subcommity together under COGGs to do something about it.

[mtnbykr]

there is a process for getting a new trail, [bike/hike/multi-use] in duluth. it starts w/ giving a presentation outlining where the trail would be built, who would build the trail, who would maintain the trail and who would pay for any materials/maintainence costs. this presentaion starts at the trails task force, moves on to the parks and rec commision and then to the city council. this is how the govt works...

this is what the superior hiking trail did in getting their trail thru town.

this process was put into place 3-5 years ago when the city began the designation of trails. this is when the hartley western trails became legal for mtbs.

this process has been explained many times to the local bike community. nothing has come of it.

showing up at meeting and saying "we need trails" is something i've been doing for 10+ years. it's taken this long to get to the point the city recognizes the need for mtb/multi-use trails. having an organized group show up w/ a plan that kicks ass would be great. be forewarned, the city of duluth has no money to put into the trails we have now, let alone a new trail. your group will also need liability insurance and a ton of volunteers.

i'm here to help. i'm on the trails task force, the starting point in all this. i've done this planning thing before on another trail project. it doesn't happen overnight. the sht spent 3 years on this before they could turn up dirt.

coggs is www.coggs.com (http://www.coggs.com) email chair@coggs.com if you're interested






buck--being the imba rep is something i do because i'm passionate about trails, it's not a job...

trailsquirell--just keep the bandit trails off city property. you never know, it might be me on the loader tearing up your trails. don't whine here when you get sued.

hansi--there is a new group in town that's working on something like you're talking about. might want to check it out. http://datadirt.wordpress.com/. you could also contact coggs and see what their thoughts are.

rudy--please, don't get that started again.

nick--call me. there's things you need to know...

[Buck]

buck--being the imba rep is something i do because i'm passionate about trails, it's not a job...

.

Its just a saying.

weRd.
Buck

[LOKI]

Hey guys,
So I know all about COGGS and have gone to many Mont Du Lac rides. I like those guys but I have not seen a big picture from them either. I like that DATA site and what those people are thinking and am certainly going to support them financially and hopefully by working on trails and whatever else it takes.
I do have a question though and to be fair I dont want this directed at you Kurt but to you. The question is this. What is an IMBA reps basic function. Sometimes I think that we the community dump certain assumptions and requests on you that you obviously just cant do. So the question is this, what is your primary function and what jobs are you able to take on and in what capacity are you most likely to be a useful and effective tool to be weilded at city obstacles? Does that make sense? You say that we have to take the initiative and that is for sure, well when do we then look to you for to take us to that next level? I had another IMBA rep here last spring doing a walk through on a possible trail that the DNR was looking at here in Carlton(he called it a no go, a good call actually), and he made it sound like he had been working for years on a single project in Crosby. Did he start with the group that created that trail system or did that group come to him once it was moving along and then use him for specific hurdles or did he come to them with the idea and help organize them and educate them as to what needed to be done when, who needed to spoken to, what offices needed to be contacted etc? Are IMBA reps organizers and inciters or facilitators later on in the process?

[toasthaiku]

Seems like one way or another they could use a more organized mountain bike front in Duluth.


COGGS is tough to figure out. They didn't reply to the Parks & Rec email. The Duluth News Tribune today ran their annual calendar of races without Powder Monkey or Dirt Spanker, which indicates COGGS didn't send in a free notice.

My job is marketing at a local company and one of the best parts is sponsoring regional sports. Our budget is, um, generous. I contacted COGGS twice about supporting Powder and Spanker but got one noncommittal reply. Thousands I would've spent on mountain biking is sponsoring promising races like the Duluth Duathlon and the new Madeline Island Triathlon.

I'm a COGGS member and will renew this year. Got to support the local club, the Monday night rides at Mont du Lac are great and I'm on the Powder Monkey trails almost every dry week.

[toasthaiku]

showing up at meeting and saying "we need trails" is something i've been doing for 10+ years. it's taken this long to get to the point the city recognizes the need for mtb/multi-use trails. having an organized group show up w/ a plan that kicks ass would be great. be forewarned, the city of duluth has no money to put into the trails we have now, let alone a new trail. your group will also need liability insurance and a ton of volunteers.

Good points, Kurt. I figured the news was worth sharing. If a group or some riders had a project in mind, now would be a good time to bring it forward. Sorry if I gave a naive Mr. Smith Goes To Washington impression. Never said this would be easy or funded. One look at the Skateboard Park project proves that. :D

[Tone Coughlin]

COGGS is not the only MTB club in town. Lake Superior Cycling Club (www.lakesuperiorcycling.org (http://www.lakesuperiorcycling.org)) is the ONLY USA Cycling (Road, Track, NORBA, CX, BMX, Downhill, Freeride) registered club in Duluth or northern MN. We are also members of IMBA. If you want a club to support your new or current trail systems, contact us. info@duluthracing.com

We are looking at building some new trails and adopting some old ones to fill some illegal gaps within the next couple of years. We have liability insurance, a solid budget for maintenance, GPS mapping systems, and hard working volunteers that are willing to work on trails.

Tone Coughlin
President
Lake Superior Cycling Club

[mtnbykr]

Are IMBA reps organizers and inciters or facilitators later on in the process?

yes...both...all...

we are here to help at any level that's needed. i have been involved in the trail planning/marking stages and have given presentations to a city council to get a trail project approved.