And the verdict is....

[Matt H]

....I rode it way too slow, and wiped. :hit:

Still, it should be rideable, so long as you can maintain a full head of steam into the turn.

Take a gander at the picture:

http://www.morcmtb.org/photopost/showphoto.php?photo=2548&cat=506

[TML]

I should have brought my bike with me today and checked it out over lunch.

Hope you didn't do any damage to yourself Matt.

Great work last night everyone! I'm looking forward to riding it!

[berrywise]

The power of photography to make that thing look like it's a flat trail :D

[LightWeight]

So do you ride up that thing or is it a downhill switchback?

[Matt H]

So do you ride up that thing or is it a downhill switchback?

It's a downhill--definitely a one-way!

The photo doesn't give proper prospective, but it's a hard 90 degree turn to the left, followed by the sweeping rocky descent pictured. From the rocks at the bottom of the photo to the rocks at the top is a descent of (maybe) 15 vertical feet...

[Matt H]

I should have brought my bike with me today and checked it out over lunch.

Hope you didn't do any damage to yourself Matt.

Great work last night everyone! I'm looking forward to riding it!

Oh, I'm fine....just a couple of scratches and a slight case of gutlessness. Shoulda taken it at speed.

Which brings up a different point....does MORC carry any sort of liability insurance, in case someone (like those kids without helmets from last night), decides to break their necks and sue us?

[TML]

Which brings up a different point....does MORC carry any sort of liability insurance, in case someone (like those kids without helmets from last night), decides to break their necks and sue us?

In as much as I know how to explain it, yes. MORC as a non-profit, volunteer organization is well protected from any law suit related to an injury suststained on a trail that we maintain. We as trailworkers would have to do something severely negligent (piano wire at head height across trail) in order for a claim to succeed against us.

The MORC board has had conversations with our insurance agent and also with lawyers about this issue. They have all stated that it would be very, very difficult to bring a suit against MORC and even more so to bring a suit against volunteer trailworkers working with permission on public land.

[Crash]

It's a downhill--definitely a one-way!

Where is the "wall of death" located? Is this the old "plastic pallet" descent?

Nice work everyone. Looking forward to riding it!

[FarmerBEN]

In as much as I know how to explain it, yes. MORC as a non-profit, volunteer organization is well protected from any law suit related to an injury suststained on a trail that we maintain. We as trailworkers would have to do something severely negligent (piano wire at head height across trail) in order for a claim to succeed against us.

The MORC board has had conversations with our insurance agent and also with lawyers about this issue. They have all stated that it would be very, very difficult to bring a suit against MORC and even more so to bring a suit against volunteer trailworkers working with permission on public land.

does that include private land? A local atv club wants to get permission from numerous land owners to create a trail along the winter snowmobile trail route, being that they want to cross our land I am opposed to the idea, but what if a similar idea could be implented for a mountain bike trail system?

[TML]

Where is the "wall of death" located? Is this the old "plastic pallet" descent?

Nice work everyone. Looking forward to riding it!

Thanks Craig.

WoD is the next downhill to the east that comes out to the tar path a little up stream from the pallet climb or descent.

[TML]

does that include private land? A local atv club wants to get permission from numerous land owners to create a trail along the winter snowmobile trail route, being that they want to cross our land I am opposed to the idea, but what if a similar idea could be implented for a mountain bike trail system?

In this case you are safe for the most part as well. MN has a law that protects private land owners that open their land to public recreation as long as the landowner is not charging a fee for use of the land.

Without this protection we wouldn't have anywhere near the number of snowmobile trails in the state that we do now, as many are ran across portions of private land.

I'm no lawyer, so do further research for yourself but the law is out there. I'll post up the statute # if I find it.

[Crash]

Thanks Craig.

WoD is the next downhill to the east that comes out to the tar path a little up stream from the pallet climb or descent.

I think we are talking the same one. It used to have black pallets in the switch back a couple of years ago and is a downhill only. I forgot the other climb/descent also has a couple pallets in it. Sorry for the confusion. Man - I need to get over there more!

[FSSS]

...bring a suit against volunteer trailworkers working with permission on public land.

This is one of the most important points - the land manager has the ultimate responsibility for what is on the land they manage. This is why getting land manager approval for the trail and its features is so important (and sometimes difficult).

[Kingbozo]

I think we are talking the same one. It used to have black pallets in the switch back a couple of years ago and is a downhill only. I forgot the other climb/descent also has a couple pallets in it. Sorry for the confusion. Man - I need to get over there more!

Didn't the WOD have some sort of rubber matting on the switchback at one point?

[berrywise]

Didn't the WOD have some sort of rubber matting on the switchback at one point?

Both of the trails that run from uptop down to the bike path near the creek had plastic meshing built into sections of it to help with erosion. Problem was the matting itself got torn up and became even more of a problem. The real deadly part of the Wall of Death were the metal pipes that used to be pounded into the ground in that area. They stuck up about a foot and if you endo'd onto one you'd impale yourself.

[Brick]

Didn't the WOD have some sort of rubber matting on the switchback at one point?

One and the same, the matting was pulled a couple of years ago, it was getting pretty badly torn up (I OTB'd a couple of times on it)--I'm still suffering from some some gutlessness issues w. this segment of trail myself.

[Matt H]

One and the same, the matting was pulled a couple of years ago, it was getting pretty badly torn up (I OTB'd a couple of times on it)--I'm still suffering from some some gutlessness issues w. this segment of trail myself.

I remember being happy as a clam when the matting first went in, because that turn was really fugly before.

[Don Youngdahl]

does that include private land? ....................... they want to cross our land I am opposed to the idea, but what if a similar idea could be implented for a mountain bike trail system?

The law Troy mentioned in a another post on this thread is Minnesota Statutes 604A.21 thru 604A.27. You can find it here: http://www.leg.state.mn.us/leg/statutes.asp

If you grant a written easement, you actually have more liability protection than you would have on an unauthorized trail through your land, regardless of whether you had it posted or not.

I'm told that Minnesota case law has established the general principle that the duty of care owed any trespasser on private land is to "warn or mitigate against man-made hazards". I take that to mean that, for example, the land owner might be at risk due to that abandoned hay rake sitting in the grass 10 feet off the trail.

The statute I mentioned states, among other things, that the land owner who grants a written easement "owes no duty of care to render or maintain the land safe for entry or use by other persons for recreational purposes";
"owes no duty to warn those persons of any dangerous condition on the land, whether patent or latent"; "owes no duty of care toward those persons except to refrain from willfully taking action to cause injury"

Anyone that is in the game of advocating for recreational trails, and who might have occasion to talk to private property owners, should certainly be familiar with these statutes.

Don Youngdahl

[TML]

Thanks Don, for posting the statute and elaborating a bit on it.


Rode the newly re-worked section last night. Rode well last night. Feels pretty solid too. We will fine tune it a little next week but it should be good to go! I'm anxious to see it after another couple of rains.

The section as routed, is ultimately unsustainable but my hope is that the band-aid we put on this time ends up to be industrial strength! Sure is fun to ride!

Got to see Don D. and Craig I. on the trail last night as well. Nice seeing ya guys!

[Crash]

Got to see Don D. and Craig I. on the trail last night as well. Nice seeing ya guys!

hey - many thanks for all the hard work!:banana: