Trail work?

[Trevize1138]

Is there going to be much trail work at Leb this year? Seems like we sorta "completed" it last year so does this mean that only every now and then we'll get a crew together to do maintenance?

[bigwheel]

Is there going to be much trail work at Leb this year? Seems like we sorta "completed" it last year so does this mean that only every now and then we'll get a crew together to do maintenance?

My understanding is that John and Doug were going to share the work group (alternate) between Leb and Terrace Oaks.

IMO, we should also include Salem. Then, we can could get a lot of progress done each night, making it more fun. Also, it might be a handy way to deal with tools and stuff. Just have somebody show up with the loaded morc trailer, and we will know that we have enough for whoever shoes up.

[nigel]

I will get with John L so we can get things planned out for the year. Between his work and my just getting a house we're both pretty busy right now! I know there will be an Eagle project taking place at Leb and there is a lot of reclamation to do at Leb and Terrace so that alone will take up a lot of time. I'll get with John soon and we'll get things rolling.

Douglas

[Tetreves]

I know there's a teeter to be fixed out at Leb as well...

Congrats on the house Doug! We still need to go for a ride sometime.

[gopherhockey]

Is there going to be much trail work at Leb this year? Seems like we sorta "completed" it last year so does this mean that only every now and then we'll get a crew together to do maintenance?

Definitely not going to be as much work as there was last year... but there definitely are still projects to do - probably more than we can complete this year. As Doug said, we'll get together and hopefully get things rolling soon. I am guessing Lebanon won't be weekly at all this year like years past - every other week most likely - and even then I may need some help, I have a really nasty work year ahead of me this year. :cryin:

[Ubergiant]

and how would people know what to bring and what to do? I've been riding leb for more than a few years now and I'd like to help out with the trails I ride. I just joined MORC tonight so I have no idea how you guys organize work groups.

[gopherhockey]

and how would people know what to bring and what to do? I've been riding leb for more than a few years now and I'd like to help out with the trails I ride. I just joined MORC tonight so I have no idea how you guys organize work groups.

Here is a FAQ on trailwork at Lebanon:

http://www.morcmtb.org/forums/faq.php?faq=new_faq_item_trailwork#faq_new_faq_ite m_lebanon_trailwork

Welcome to MORC, we'd definitely love to have ya out to help out once work gets underway!

[dave t]

Are there any plans to make a return loop within XX for the riders who like to just do stunts all day long?
I can think of two reasons this would be a good idea:
It could take some pressure off the first (and wettest) half of the X.
It could discourage poaching cuts through the woods to adjacent trail segments.

The logical place would be from the troll log back to the 180 before the rock jump leading to the big rock garden. It would miss the first bit of XX but would probably only take permission and a rake to build.

[Trevize1138]

Not a bad idea, Dave, but it seems a tad redundant as we do have the X loop there as a cut-over to keep doing loops through the XX. Yes, it's the wettest part of the X and it might be good to take some pressure off it, but I would think a better use of time and resources would be to keep fixing up that part of the X to be more accomodating to wet weather. :)

[gopherhockey]

Are there any plans to make a return loop within XX for the riders who like to just do stunts all day long?
I can think of two reasons this would be a good idea:
It could take some pressure off the first (and wettest) half of the X.
It could discourage poaching cuts through the woods to adjacent trail segments.

The logical place would be from the troll log back to the 180 before the rock jump leading to the big rock garden. It would miss the first bit of XX but would probably only take permission and a rake to build.

Yea, we have no plans to continue the XX... only improve the X or re-route if necessary.

If we get people poaching or continuing to poach Dakota will close down the XX loop or make us cut it smaller so access is not available to poach, so that should solve that... its all of our responsibility to watch so people don't continue to do that.

I think of the X as making the XX loop longer - there are often few differences between the two trails. The XX is actually less challenging in places. People doing circles should enjoy the benefit of riding a longer circle.

[soupboy]

...make the new and improved teeter a double teeter...or add a second teeter that spans those silly logs between the last rock gardens in the XX loop.

Sean

I know there's a teeter to be fixed out at Leb as well...

Congrats on the house Doug! We still need to go for a ride sometime.

[Thewavebb]

[QUOTE=soupboy]...make the new and improved teeter a double teeter./QUOTE]

ooooooooooohhhhhhhhh that would be so awsome. I would throw down on that and If(when) I crash and hurt myself I would come and take pictures of people crashing. Its a win win for me.

[bigwheel]

...make the new and improved teeter a double teeter...or add a second teeter that spans those silly logs between the last rock gardens in the XX loop.

Sean

Here we go again with the logs. This is one of the areas where it is really nice to be riding a 29er. The faster you ride them, the easier they get.

[Buck]

...make the new and improved teeter a double teeter...or add a second teeter that spans those silly logs between the last rock gardens in the XX loop.

Sean

Or learn how to hop that shat!!! w00t! :banana: ;)

L8R
Buck

[tedsti]

...make the new and improved teeter a double teeter...or add a second teeter that spans those silly logs between the last rock gardens in the XX loop.

Sean

Well, if the rest of us can handle them just fine on our 26" kiddie wheels, there should be absolutely noooo problem doing them on big manly 29" wheels. Unless of course it is an operator issue.....

[Tex]

This is one of the areas where it is really nice to be riding a 29er. The faster you ride them, the easier they get.

As a person who rides a big, heavy, plush, dual suspension bike, all I can say is "what logs?" :scream:

[dave t]

If we get people poaching or continuing to poach Dakota will close down the XX loop or make us cut it smaller so access is not available to poach, so that should solve that... its all of our responsibility to watch so people don't continue to do that.

I think of the X as making the XX loop longer - there are often few differences between the two trails. The XX is actually less challenging in places. People doing circles should enjoy the benefit of riding a longer circle.

Trying to help cut down on the riders "camping out" on a stunt is what I was thinking. Maybe shortening the approved return trip would discourage hanging out at the camelback or the teeter etc. Not all riders are looking for a longer loop and even more would like to see a easy return to try again after dabbing an obstacle.

We created a section that is no longer just a trail but a series of fun challenges that some riders want to conquor or ride over and over again rather than the loop as a whole. The only sure solution would be mini return loops at the problem areas to allow what riders are going to do anyway and get rid of one more instance we feel the need to sound like uptight Nancys out to stop all the fun.

I would hate to see the loop shortened or eliminated without trying a few things to maybe limit the cutting and the area I was thinking about couldn't take an hour to build. I see your point too and this is just an idea. If it is just a time and resources issue, I'll go out there and do it. If it is just not a welcome change - that's fine too.

[TrailDale]

Seems like the old "law of unintended consequences".
The folks that designed the X and XX loops are cross-country riders who ride the common 4-inch travel XC bikes. We designed an built stunts that would challenge riders and in several cases, stunts that the designers could not ride. There's several things on the XX loop that Wegner and I won't attempt, but curiously, we have no "non-attempt" stunts in common. Maybe it has something to do with both of us breaking ribs on the first XX test rides????? Lundell on the other hand rides everything.

Anywho, we built stunts, and now we are "surprised" when there's a group of riders unlike us, who prefer stunt riding to XC laps. Hmmmmmmmmm, think of that - people who aren't just like us. Where did this strange mutation come from? I guess its hard to think outside the box when you're focusing on building stuff that you think is cool.

Bottom line is that we designed the X loops as difficult XC loops, thinking that that XC riders would be drawn to them. While that was true, a different breed of rider showed up as well, and the stunts are just as appealing. Unintentially, we uncovered an untapped market for stunt riding. So what do we do?
Ignore it?
Discourage it?
Ban it?
Embrace it?
Encourage it?
As far as IMBA goes, they have in the last 3 years, gone from ignoring downhill / free-riding, to embracing and encouraging it. The problems they saw nationwide were occurring when people bought long-travel bikes and invaded the traditional XC trails, and began riding them as stunt parks - sound familiar? At first, IMBA saw this as a threat. They quickly realized that this was just another evolutional twist in mountain biking, and that with the right direction and guidance, it could be a big positive, instead of a negative.

We (John, Tim, Dale) need to meet with Dakota County Parks very soon and sell the idea of a mini "stunt park" area within Leb Hills. This could be separated from the XC trails or a new stunt loop. This concept has been pitched twice in the last couple years, but met resistance both times. With the successes happening at Steeplachase, and the change in rider makeup at Leb Hills, we need to make another, very convincing presentation, but before we do that, we will get both the managers covering Leb Hills, out there on bikes.

Other thoughts?

[bigwheel]

Other thoughts?

Nice post, Dale.

Aren't we running out of room at Leb? Would it make more sense to put the stunt park somewhere else? I'd hate to wear out our welcome at Leb.

[gopherhockey]

Nice post, Dale.

Aren't we running out of room at Leb? Would it make more sense to put the stunt park somewhere else? I'd hate to wear out our welcome at Leb.

There are a couple of places we had picked out for a special area like this... but I hear what you are saying. I think Leb would lend itself to a place like this pretty well since Dakota has been so good about working with us, but we should also think about other places as well for sure.

[Kosk]

Keep in mind what Nat showed us at the IMBA school:

A simple log ride can easily enhance the difficulty of a trail, without posing a risk to riders.

Wether they are natural logs, or man man-made skinnies, they can sit next to the edge of the single track and riders have the option to ride by on the dirt, or pull up and ride the line. They don't have to be high to be fun or challenging, especially if they are several logs long, twisting and turning, all connected together, etc. I can envsion several sections of trail in the XX loop that could be spanned with an optional "log ride" line. I know there are a two such obstacles now, but I'm thinking more extened, longer sections of continous skinnies (for example extend the end of the narrow rainbow option onto a few logs, and run them together, all the way to the turn before the base of the water-bar climb, then you have two options take the skinny or just ride dirt singel track). Suff like this could potentially satisfy some of the "rumblings" for more "tech" features. It can be applied to all trails around here, not just Leb!

Jumps and drops though on the other hand, they require some type of designated area, or filter, to keep the lesser experienced from getting hurt, that's a whole 'nother mess. The beauty of a log ride is that for an un-enlightened rider, they won't even realize what it is, to them it is just a log laying next to the trail.

[Ish]

Aren't we running out of room at Leb?

How about going East of Johhny Cake and building a nice 20 mile xc loop all the way out towards Dodd and back. Oh, and then putting a stunt park in there somewhere :D


Man it's fun to dream!

[NDK]

We should try to convince eagan to let us build more trails over by my house in leb. It is on the boarder of rosemount and is by shults beach (sp?). Its also kind a off of highway 3. If we built there, I could be out there building every day because its right next to my house.

[pitts]

yeah, it would be awsome to have biking near the new visitor center, north shore style would be so awsome. i wish there was anything remotley close to the north shore here to ride. also, buck hill was fun today, rain is awsome to race in!

[UberCannondale]

Just wondering where on the site i can find a schedual of when the trail maintenence is going to happen if any

[gopherhockey]

Just wondering where on the site i can find a schedual of when the trail maintenence is going to happen if any

The calendar is the place to go, as well as looking around in the Lebanon Hills forum. I always post a new thread regarding any upcoming trail work. We have been slow to get rolling this year because we have fewer projects (and I currently have no tools). There will be trail work coming up soon though - stay tuned! (probably Tuesday, May 17)

[TrailDale]

How about going East of Johhny Cake and building a nice 20 mile xc loop all the way out towards Dodd and back. Oh, and then putting a stunt park in there somewhere :D


Man it's fun to dream!

Great minds think alike.
That was the original proposal to Dakota County in 1999 (start at the current MTB trails and construct a 20 mile loop east to Hwy 3 and back). How did it fly?
Think "Led Zepplin".

Although at one point on the XX trail, Lundell did get to construct his "Stairway to MTB Heaven"

The request for 20 miles went something like . . .
Hey! How about . . . NO.
But what if we . . . NO.
On the other hand, we could . . . . NO.
Then again we could just confine ourselves to a little 80-acre patch and not bother anyone else . . . . NOW YOU'RE TALKIN'.

Mountain bikers were the "new user group" and we hadn't been around very long. No trust had been built up until we brought IMBA in for a school in 2001. Also, a bigger factor was that the Johnney Cake campground had just been expanded (more than doubling its size) in 1998 and nothing about a campground expansion was ever mentioned or approved in any Master Plan for the park. Somebody had approved an unauthorized major construction project which resulted in a huge number of big oak trees being cut down for the new campground, which cut right through the main XC ski trail, and changed the character of the park for dozens of (angry) residents. What was a park view, became a trailer-park view. There was a strong anti-development sentiment in developing the 2001 master plan, and that definately affected how the MTB trail proposals were perceived.

I initially asked for 20 miles. Dropped it to 9 miles, and then got it cut by the plan consultant back to 4.5 miles total (when there were already 2.5 miles there). What saved us was the provision that I got included that allowed for possible future trail development if the 4.5 miles was seen as a positive impact on the park. It was, and we're almost at the 9-mile mark right now.

Long story - sorry.

Oh - back on point - we DO have approval RIGHT NOW for a stunt area at Salem Hills. The City of Inver Grove Heights just put in a new skate park last summer, right next to their city offices, so they are well versed in user liability. All we need are ideas, workers, and materials.

[bigwheel]

Any chance of south-side work happening on Tuesday eve this week (5/17) ?

Leb???
Terrace???
Salem???
River Bottoms??
Murphy???

Since the weather sucks and I'm still without my good bike, this would be an excellent week to dig in the dirt.

I know that we have work to do at Theo, but it's really tough getting there in the evening from the southern burbs. (also, I"m booked for the next 3 wednesdays)

Anyway, if there is anything going on, please email me.

Bob S. -- strong back, weak mind

[gopherhockey]

Unfortunately I haven't had a lot of time yet to get anything organized, and Im' still missing all my tools.

What I'd like to do is address the teeter and get that fixed, but before we do that we need to have some ideas and perhaps buy some materials.

Maybe if you wanted to round up anyone interested to go take a look at the teeter and build a plan that could be done tomorrow... I might be able to make it. We wouldn't need a huge crew for that, just a few key engineer types... then the next Tuesday we could maybe fix the teeter and get it back into production...

Ideas have been to replace the entire wood part that is cracked, or perhaps use some kind of metal brace to re-inforce it and stop the cracking... ?



Any chance of south-side work happening on Tuesday eve this week (5/17) ?

Leb???
Terrace???
Salem???
River Bottoms??
Murphy???

Since the weather sucks and I'm still without my good bike, this would be an excellent week to dig in the dirt.

I know that we have work to do at Theo, but it's really tough getting there in the evening from the southern burbs. (also, I"m booked for the next 3 wednesdays)

Anyway, if there is anything going on, please email me.

Bob S. -- strong back, weak mind

[bigwheel]

Leb fix-up Tues 5/17 at 6pm ??
<hr size="1" style="color: rgb(204, 204, 204);"> <!-- / icon and title --> <!-- message --> (cross-post from Leb conditions thread)

Sounds like there are a couple chores to do:
1: Take care of the downed trees
2: Take a good look at the Teeter and make a recommendation

Unless someone has a different suggestion, I will be at the Leb parking lot at 6pm. *If* the gate is locked, I'll drive around to the galaxy side. I'll hang out at my van (brown Astro) until 6pm, then head in.

I'll bring a chainsaw, a plain shovel, rake and camp axe. (Polaski is on order.) If anyone else can make it, that would be great. Otherwise, I'll probably take care of the downed tree first, because it could be dangerous.

Pat, I'd also appreciate a little more info about where the trees are down. From your description, it sounds like the XX section after the rock garden, before the first XX bridge.

[gopherhockey]

I'll try get out there, but from what it look like now I won't get outa here until 6-7... :cryin:

I'll try get my act together and have a regular trailwork session next Tuesday. Hopefully it will be nice and sunny and dry then!

[tedsti]

I may be able to make it. Don't wait if I'm not there though.


Ted

[bigwheel]

I'll hang around (main lot, or galaxy if lot is closed) until 6pm, then head in. Assuming I'm by myself, I'll head into the dream trail, and try to find the downed trees. I'll carry in a chainsaw and shovel, but have an axe, rake and clippers in my van. I'll have my phone with: 612 414 4379

[bigwheel]

Ted and I cleaned up the trees. They were early on the Dream-1, where the trail sweeps around the edge of the "canyon". A birch fell away from the hill, and the root ball left a hole in the trail. The other was just a tree that blew over into the trail.

We took the downed tree, and made a ground-level log crossing to fill in the hole. We left the main part of the tree trunk just uphill of the trail, so that JL can later do something clever to further upset the anti-log activists.

We also chastised two bikers (20'sh, no helmets) for riding when the trail was obviously closed. The main gate was locked, and the Galaxy entrances were fenced off.

The trail was wet, but it looked like one full day of sunshine and wind, and it would be rideable again.

[bigwheel]

The Teeter is not in that bad of shape. The split is on the bottom-side, starting at a knot under the pivot. It would have to break upward (unlikely) for the split to be a problem. The backing board is not split (yet). So, it is probably rideable, but we may as well fix it right.

Ted and I concluded that all we need to do is replace the backing boards with longer ones, to spread out the load.

Materials needed:
One 8ft 2x8 treated, cut into two 4ft sections. Note: Try to get a nice one without any huge knots.
Eight 4inch long, 1/2inch bolts with nuts, and 16 washers. (assuming we also reuse the old bolts)
(Recommend) Also some construction glue to assist the bolts holding the backing board to the teeter rail.

Tools needed:
A couple adjustable wrenches
Cordless drill with half-inch bit and a hole saw (2" ??)
A Hammer or rock for tapping bolts out/in

It will take about an hour or so to fix, and we can do it on site.

[Tim Wegner]

Bob

How about reinforcing the board using a piece of angle iron or a steel 1" square tube? The iron could be predrilled off site and then you would just have to drill through the wood protion on site. I have access to some angle iron in 6' lengths and could get them to you next week.
Tim

[tedsti]

We would have to run two pieces on each side if we went with something like angle iron or tube since we would want to reinforce both above and below the axle. A 2x8 will reinforce both above and below the axle and also help carry the axle load. The teeter really didn't look bad. The crack was small and probably would have been fine but we might as well shore it up since we have it apart.

Bob

How about reinforcing the board using a piece of angle iron or a steel 1" square tube? The iron could be predrilled off site and then you would just have to drill through the wood protion on site. I have access to some angle iron in 6' lengths and could get them to you next week.
Tim

[Magic]

Tim, wouldn't aluminum work better? I think the steel angle will rust out. I know it would take awhile for this to happen, but a 3/16" -1/4" piece of aluminum would last longer. It also could be drilled on site since it's such lite gauge. Just my 2 cents.

[bigwheel]

We would have to run two pieces on each side if we went with something like angle iron or tube since we would want to reinforce both above and below the axle. A 2x8 will reinforce both above and below the axle and also help carry the axle load. The teeter really didn't look bad. The crack was small and probably would have been fine but we might as well shore it up since we have it apart.

Also, the 2x8 backing board is only about 2 ft long. If we were to back that with steel (or aluminum), we'd either have to limit our reinforcement to 2 ft, or we'd have to replace the 2x8 anyway. Square tubing would be easy to work with, because it (from menards or fleet farm) comes already drilled every inch. However, we thought it would be best to extend the length of the backing board to spread the load out.

Ted also reminded me that the new treated lumber doesn't get along with all types of steel, so we need to be careful what types of metal we use for this.

The easiest way to brace it would have been to put the new brace on the outside, but we were afraid that it would interfere with the legs.

[Tim Wegner]

Bob

If you want to reinforce on the outside all you would need would be a longer piece of pipe for the pivot. I can make that for you at the hardware store for 0 cost. Just let me know what length you need and I will thread it for you. Also what is the diameter of the pipe.
Tim

[bigwheel]

Bob

If you want to reinforce on the outside all you would need would be a longer piece of pipe for the pivot. I can make that for you at the hardware store for 0 cost. Just let me know what length you need and I will thread it for you. Also what is the diameter of the pipe.
Tim

The pipe is 1 1/4 inch Schedule 40, threaded on both ends. There is also a PVC sleeve, made with 2inch schd 40 PVC, which will have to be extended. (a clever design) Unfortunately, I don't know the length of the pipes. If we were to go that route -- second 2x8 backing plate or steel, bolted to outside of the platform -- it would save us some hassle tearing out the old inner plate. We'll need to make another trip in to measure it, but I can probably do that tomorrow during lunch.

I'd like to hear Ted's opinion on this. He's the one with the ME degree.

[tedsti]

If we replace the short pieces on the inside with 4' 2x8, then we do not have to make a new axle and sleeve. All we would need is the wood and 8 3 1/2" bolts/nuts. This would also look a little cleaner. The only hang-up will be if the 2 short 2x8s are nailed in as well as bolted. This would make them a PITA to remove. I vote for this option if there are no nails. Oops forgot, we should put a little Liquid Nails in there and it will be solid as all .....


If we put the 4' 2x8 on the outside, then we need a new axle and sleeve and wind up with a little wider base. We would gain a little strength where the axle goes through from being 3 pieces thick. This will look like it was patched, and just not look as clean.

[gopherhockey]

If we replace the short pieces on the inside with 4' 2x8, then we do not have to make a new axle and sleeve. All we would need is the wood and 8 3 1/2" bolts/nuts. This would also look a little cleaner. The only hang-up will be if the 2 short 2x8s are nailed in as well as bolted. This would make them a PITA to remove. I vote for this option if there are no nails. Oops forgot, we should put a little Liquid Nails in there and it will be solid as all .....


If we put the 4' 2x8 on the outside, then we need a new axle and sleeve and wind up with a little wider base. We would gain a little strength where the axle goes through from being 3 pieces thick. This will look like it was patched, and just not look as clean.

What I am hearing is that we need:

4' 2x8s Quantity: 2
2 1/2" bolts/nuts Quantity: 8

What tools would we need to be able to go out and install this? Woudl we need to drill a new hole through the 2x8s for the pivot?

Think we could pull this all together by next Tuesday? Woudl be fun to go out and get Mr. Teeter back in working order.

We also have the metric teeter that doesn't have a base. I think the teeter portion is still at Dale's house. Maybe if its going to keep raining we can do a session where we build a base for Mr. Metric Teeter?

BTW: thanks for taking care of those things last night guys!!! U ROCK! :banana:

[bigwheel]

The bolts are going through 2 boards (3"), so they will need to be 3 1/2 or 4" long.

I think with a couple people working on it, the fix can be done in about an hour.

Tools - I think will need:
2 adjustable crecent wrenches
Drill, with a bit for the bolt holes, plus a hole saw bit.
A Hammer
Maybe a large slotted screwdriver
As Ted mentioned, some glue between boards will make it stronger.

I have the tools and hole saw, and can be there on Tuesday night. However, I can't hang out late, because I am flying out of town *early* wednesday morning.

WHAT IS A METRIC TEETER? (probably something else for me to fall off of) :crazy2:

I really like the job that was done for the legs and pivot of the existing teeter. If the metric deathtrap has a similar pivot, then I suggest using the same design as the existing teeter.


What I am hearing is that we need:

4' 2x8s Quantity: 2
2 1/2" bolts/nuts Quantity: 8

What tools would we need to be able to go out and install this? Woudl we need to drill a new hole through the 2x8s for the pivot?

Think we could pull this all together by next Tuesday? Woudl be fun to go out and get Mr. Teeter back in working order.

We also have the metric teeter that doesn't have a base. I think the teeter portion is still at Dale's house. Maybe if its going to keep raining we can do a session where we build a base for Mr. Metric Teeter?

BTW: thanks for taking care of those things last night guys!!! U ROCK! :banana:

[gopherhockey]

Cool, lets plan on making the teeter our Tuesday job. I'll get it on the calendar. If more show up we can have them put more logs on the log death trap ride before the rock garden. DOH! (just kidding Sean E...)

Tim W - you out there, can you get the parts we need?

BTW: you are right, metric teeter was a bit shorter, a bit thinner.. in metric measurements for our IMBA crew from Canada.

[Tim Wegner]

Looks like all you need are some bolts. I could get them on Monday. Leaving for Denver this afternoon and won't get back until Sunday night. Do you want stainless with locking nuts? any flat washers? What diameter bolts do you want?

John, Can you bring in my paper and mail for the next couple of days? The garage door code has not changed. Just set everything on the steps in the garage.
TW

[bigwheel]

Looks like all you need are some bolts. I could get them on Monday. Leaving for Denver this afternoon and won't get back until Sunday night. Do you want stainless with locking nuts? any flat washers? What diameter bolts do you want?

John, Can you bring in my paper and mail for the next couple of days? The garage door code has not changed. Just set everything on the steps in the garage.
TW

Then, I assume we already have the 2x8's. We are looking for 2 4-ft boards. Length doesn't have to be exact. We just want them long enough to spread out the load.

I don't know the specifics about corrosion of treated lumber on galvanzied bolts. Maybe Ted or someone can answer this. However, since we're only buying a few bolts, it probably won't be that much extra cash to get stainless. The main problem would be the extra hassle of getting them.

We'll probably want 7/16 or 1/2 inch bolts. Around 3 1/2 or 4 inches long. We will also need 16 flat washers.

Locking nuts would be nice. Otherwise, I can bring along some red loctite.

Ted, do you have some wood glue?

Thanks.

[tedsti]

Stainless would be better since the new treated lumber is nasty on fasteners. I am guessing that the ones that are on there already are stainless. Hot dip galvanized will do if we can't find stainless locally. We could order stainless ones from www.mcmaster.com (http://www.mcmaster.com) Actually, I may have enough galvanized fasterners left over from when I built the deck on my last house. They will probably be a little long, but that shouldn't hurt anything. I will check tonight.

I will pick up some adhesive.


Then, I assume we already have the 2x8's. We are looking for 2 4-ft boards. Length doesn't have to be exact. We just want them long enough to spread out the load.

I don't know the specifics about corrosion of treated lumber on galvanzied bolts. Maybe Ted or someone can answer this. However, since we're only buying a few bolts, it probably won't be that much extra cash to get stainless. The main problem would be the extra hassle of getting them.

We'll probably want 7/16 or 1/2 inch bolts. Around 3 1/2 or 4 inches long. We will also need 16 flat washers.

Locking nuts would be nice. Otherwise, I can bring along some red loctite.

Ted, do you have some wood glue?

Thanks.

[Tim Wegner]

I will pick up stainless from my hardware store where I get the employee discount. Locking nuts etc will also be stainless.

TW

[helmut buster]

I have quite a few 1/2" ss bolts left over from a recent project. I'll see if I have anything longer than 3-1/2. If I have em I'll let you know tomorrow.

Anything for an excuse to ride despite the less than ideal conditions.

"I'm riding on the closed trails because I had to drop off teeter repair parts."

I'll be real careful!

[gopherhockey]

John, Can you bring in my paper and mail for the next couple of days? The garage door code has not changed. Just set everything on the steps in the garage.
TW

Will do. I'll keep your dirty mags for ya until you return... ;) (kidding)

I'll post regarding trail work on Tuesday.... sounds like we haev the parts and a plan!