sugar 4+ or Jamis Dakar sport

[Jordan M.]

I hope someone can help me decide what my first full suspension bike should be. I want something that I can race with next year.....I have two choices the gary fisher sugar 4+ and the Jamis dakar sport. I've ridden the sugar once and It seemed really plush.

Here are some specs for the fisher

Frame Material: aluminum
Frame Angles: Unspecified
Sizes: 16", 17.5", 19", 21"
Colors: Blue Metallic/Silver Metallic
Fork: Answer Manitou Axel Super, 70-100mm travel
Rear Shock: Rock Shox Bar Adjust
Brake Levers: aluminum linear-pull
Handlebar: Bontrager Crowbar Sport
Stem: Bontrager Sport
Headset: 1 1/8" threadless Aheadset / Semi-Cartidge
Front Der: Shimano Deore LX
Crankset: Bontrager Select, 22/32/44 teeth
Rear Der: Shimano Deore LX
Pedals: Shimano PD-M505 SPD
Tires: 26 x 2.10" IRC Mythos XC

Here are specs for the Dakar sport-


Frame Material: 7005 aluminum
Frame Angles: 71.0 head, 74.0 seat
Sizes: 13", 15", 17", 19", 21"
Colors: Grey/Black
Fork: Answer Manitou Black Sport, 100mm travel
Rear Shock: Fox Vanilla Coil, 90mm travel
Brake Levers: Hayes HML-1 Mechanical Disc
Handlebar: aluminum, 1" rise
Stem: Jamis aluminum
Headset: 1 1/8" threadless Dia-Compe STS
Front Der: Shimano Deore, top-pull/clamp-on 31.8mm
Crankset: TruVativ Hussefelt, 22/32/44 teeth
Rear Der: Shimano Deore
Pedals: Wellgo WPD-823 clipless
Tires: 26 x 2.00" Hutchinson Mosquito IF ANYONE HAS ANY OTHER BIKES I SHOULD LOOK AT OR IF YOU HAVE A DECENT BIKE TO RACE WITH THAT YOU ARE SELLING PLEASE REPLY!! But I couldn't buy it until late may early june since I'm just a teenager and I get my money from a paper route. So it will take awhile to get around $1500 but just in time for the 05' season.

-Thanks

[nigel]

How about a Trek Fuel 70 or 80?

You can race just about anything in the range your looking at and be happy. Eventually you'll wanna upgrade drivetrains but the frames youd be getting will be great.

I suggest maybe trying out a Trek Fuel, Giant NRS and a Specialized Stumjumper FSR too. Check for proper fit, remeber stems can be swapped, seat angles can be changed ect.... Get out and ride a few, this time of year you might find some good closeout deals too on 04's

D

[noise_is_life]

Just from my unscientific and highly biased personal experience I would go Jamis before Sugar.

I've known a few past Sugar owners that have had many problems with chain suck.

[drakh]

Both i and a friend had sugars (me: 2+, him: 1) and they had a lot of problems with chain suck. I'm told the way to fix that is to replace the bontrager rings w/ Shimano rings. I never got a chance to test this. Also, the x+ sugars seem to be really heavy. Even though they have the race geometry, i don't think they're really meant to be race bikes unless you go to the high end.

That being said, i have friends who have the new Jamis Dakar's and don't like them for climbing. Too heavy in the rear. They're also 30+ lb bikes.

I'd do a little more research online before settling on either of those as your only choices. There seem to be a lot of good bikes out there for $1500 or less that will work better for racing.

Just my $1.02.

Michael

[transplant]

I know of 2 guys (both named Mike, ironically enough) who broke their Sugars in the same place, right where the seat tube meets the bottom bracket shell. Each guy weighed no more than 150-160. They were also simle cross country riders, and they weren't pushing the bikes beyond their limits. No way in hell would I buy a Sugar. Knowing of 1 break is bad enough, but 2 in the same spot, by 2 guys named Mike, is scary and a serious quality issue. If your name is Mike, stay away from Sugars! :p

[noise_is_life]

That being said, i have friends who have the new Jamis Dakar's and don't like them for climbing. Too heavy in the rear. They're also 30+ lb bikes.

I'd do a little more research online before settling on either of those as your only choices. There seem to be a lot of good bikes out there for $1500 or less that will work better for racing.

I think the Climbing and Weight issues are more specific to the Dakar XLT's which are more long travel trail bikes that XC bikes. However the Dakar XC's and probably Dakar Sport are really different beasts.

I do agree though that you should get out there and look at as many bikes as possible.

[noise_is_life]

I know of 2 guys (both named Mike, ironically enough) who broke their Sugars in the same place, right where the seat tube meets the bottom bracket shell. Each guy weighed no more than 150-160. They were also simle cross country riders, and they weren't pushing the bikes beyond their limits. No way in hell would I buy a Sugar. Knowing of 1 break is bad enough, but 2 in the same spot, by 2 guys named Mike, is scary and a serious quality issue. If your name is Mike, stay away from Sugars! :p
The '03 Jamas Dakar XLT frames had a defect like this too, I know of at least 3 people (myself included) that broke the rear triangle. The replacement and the newer frames seem to have this resoved at some level though.

Just mortgate the house, sell the car or sell yourself on the street and get a Turner 5-spot, they seem pretty sweet.

[Jordan M.]

I was looking mtbreview.com and came across the Haro xls R5. I didn't even know haro made mountain bikes. There is 11 reviews and no one says anything about cracked frames. it has 4" of rear travel and a rock shox judy c with 100mm, hayes disk............http://www.harobikes.com/2004/xlsr5/

[FSSS]

Check the weight on the Haro. All the Haros I've seen are too overbuilt to be a racing bike.

[Jordan M.]

its kinda on the heavy side standing at 30.9 pounds

[drakh]

I know of 2 guys (both named Mike, ironically enough) who broke their Sugars in the same place, right where the seat tube meets the bottom bracket shell. Each guy weighed no more than 150-160. They were also simle cross country riders, and they weren't pushing the bikes beyond their limits. No way in hell would I buy a Sugar. Knowing of 1 break is bad enough, but 2 in the same spot, by 2 guys named Mike, is scary and a serious quality issue. If your name is Mike, stay away from Sugars! :p
Wow, that's wild. Do you know which sugars and what year?
I had good luck beating on my sugar. It was a heavy bike with a heavy fork, but it handled my fat-a$$ crashing down on thru 2 years of abuse. I'm hard on my equipment. I managed to crack the rear triangle towards the end but Fisher set me up with a new one. I can't say that i have anything against the sugars other than chain suck but i don't think they're the best bikes out there and way overpriced for what you get. For about $800 more than i paid for my sugar, i got a Yeti 575 which is better in every respect. The only question is how well it will survive 2 years of me managing to pick the worst line thru every obstacle. :D

[transplant]

This was about 2-3 years ago. Granted, Fisher took pretty good care of them, but still, in the large world of mountain biking, knowing of 2 failing in the same spot within about a year of each other is freaky. You'd think GF might notice that coincidence and check into other Sugars sold or shipped to that area in that time span.